Juliemom_2
I found out about my husbands affair in August. I knew about her and I asked him stop talking to her or about her. Only to be told he was helping a friend in need nothing more. In August he went to the gym. I decided to log Into his FB. And found a private message of him saying he was at her house. I lost it. I've never been so enraged in my whole life. He came home and I bawled and three things. And he kept saying it was nothing but him helping her. Her husband was abusive and she needed a friend to help her thru the divorce process. He kept saying over and over again. It was just a friend, nothing happened. After no sleep that night I found a site that said it could recover all deleted FB messages (he was deleting them all every time they spoke , for months). So when I confronted him that I could find these message he finally admitted he had sex with her once, sent her a naked pic, and said he loved her. Devestated is not even strong enough to explain how I felt. We have since been working on us and learning about the "fog". He admits he was so focused on her as he thought he could fix her. But realized now that she called off her divorce it was all about getting him.
I'm angry. I'm mad at my husband for being so stupid and lying. I'm mad at her for being a part of wrecking my marriage. I'm trying really hard every time I visualize them together or wonder about her, changing my thought. But it's tough. I feel like I want to wallow in my anger. I want to confront her. I want answers (even thought my husband has told me ) I want to know what she was thinking. Why do I care so much about someone who tried to steal my husband?!
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SuzieQ
I'm right there with you! DD was te end of June for me, so I'm only a little ahead of you in the time line. The biggest thing u want to tell you is that your feelings aren't weird. I felt them too. Still do sometimes.

I thought about confronting my WH's AP for a long while and actually eventually decided to do it. Not telling you that's what you should do. I don't know what's best for you. I think all of our situations are a little different because they involve different people and all people are unique. I can tell you it was a difficult thing to do. Some of the things the AP had to say to me still haunt me, and I'm sure they will for a long time. But I DO NOT regret doing it. Not even a little. But you also have to be prepared for the consequences if you DO decide to talk to her.

My motivation for doing it was to 1) try to find out her intentions in the situation. Was she going to leave my WH alone or not? And 2) I wanted her to meet me and see I'm a real person with real feelings, and that she was messing with a real family.

I accomplished those things to some extent. She also had a whole lot of TRUTH to tell me about that my WH hadn't shared with me yet. Ouch. But even that I don't regret. I am thankful for it even though it was very, very painful. It was another step toward encouraging him to be totally honest. He was also shocked that his AP was so forthcoming with me and made him question her motives for being so...which helped him see her as a real person, not just a perfect fantasy.

I was also. Rey honest with my WH about my want to talk to her. He did not tell me what to do or give me an ultimatum, but he was very clear that he thought it was a bad idea. Now I know why he felt that way. But at the time he kept telling me he WAS being honest and that he had picked me and that they weren't talking anymore blah blah blah. So me confronting her helped get me closer to the truth.

Just make sure you are doing it for good reasons and are prepared to deal with consequences. Whatever they may be.

...and I have no idea when you will think clear again. I feel like my thinking has become clearer since DD but the affair is still on my mind constantly most days. I too long for a time when that will no longer be true.
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SuzieQ
And also, I identify with te anger towards the AP. Totally.

Just remember, whatever you feel for her you have to feel for your WH too. Probably more so. I mean who is she to you? No one. But he is supposed to be your best friend. The person you trust most. He promised to be true to you and forsake all others. She promised you nothing. Even if she was the persuer (goodness knows that's the story my WH tried to sell me) I don't care. He let himself be pursued. He didn't stop it. That was his responsibility to you, and he didn't hold to it.

Remember, this is all coming from someone who is trying to reconcile with my WH. And it's going well. I have real hope for us. But part of having hope is facing reality. And that's our reality.

I share these thoughts because they have helped me not to get swallowed up by the anger. I am so angry at my husvand's AP. I am less angry at my WH because of course I love him and understand him more and care about him deeply. So I'm not willing to get as mad at him. When I remind myself that te anger should be at least equal, it helps me be less mad at both. For me, anger isn't going to get me out of this hole. To get out of the hole (especially if you want to get out WITH your WH) you need to find empathy, understanding, and eventually forgiveness and anger won't help you with any of those.
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Kalmarjan
Amen, Intuition77, well said!

I dream that one day my wife will feel safe enough to do that. I have a long road ahead of me to prove myself, but I can't wait until the day comes. I dream of the day we both kick this situation to the curb and start our new beginning.

You may get your "answers" but not the way you think. Worse, you've also made contact more likely because the AP spite will drive her to contact your WS by any means necessary.

My AP actually threatened to contact my wife when I wouldn't give in to unblocking her on Facebook. She (AP) was so incensed that I would block her (messenger is for some reason her favourite thing to text to.)

It wasn't until my wife could care less about knowing about her... And I could care less about "wanting" her (from my addiction...) that she backed off. I think It was because she got pleasure from the drama. It was like, I'll make her life miserable! She claimed she wasn't in a beef with me, but it was ALL about my wife.

So, rest assured, if the AP is thinking anything right now, it's that she (or he) lost to the wife. No illusion there, every OW I've seen on shows or such is always pissed at the wife. I've seen it with a family member who ended up being the OW by accident... She was lied to, and cheated on by the guy, who also was married.

To hear her talk, it's never her mad at her "boyfriend" but mad at the wife. It boggled my brains! I simply could not believe it. But, there she was spewing dark hatred for the wife, but I could see clear as day that she should be pissed at the guy that was cheating in all three relationships he had going on at the same time!
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Juliemom_2
Thank you ALL for your insight, and understanding. I really want to work on moving forward with my husband and I but at times I don't feel I have all the answers so I feel stuck. My husband was trying to help her "fix her" to get her out of a divorce as she said her marriage was REALLY BAD. One day they were talking online and she mentioned none of the paper work was filled out yet. So my husband decided he had to go to her house to "fix it". Within five minutes of being there she was kissing him and then they had sex. Per my husband the sex lasted minutes because he felt so wrong and horrible. He stopped it and left. But the communication and her attempts to get him to sleep with her never stopped. He is normally such a clear level headed guy. How could he think going to her house would end well esp when he admits he thought sex was an option but felt he could control that and not let it happen. I can't let go of the fact in my mind he WENT there for sex. They had spoke on the phone and work (oh yeah they work together) numerous times but that day he had to go to her house to talk about her divorce. And five minutes later they are having sex yet he swears up and down that was ever his intention of going there. Maybe because my head is not in a fog I can see how unrealistic this is. He can to....NOW! But still swears it was never about sex it was always about fixing her. He is also learning in therapy this is a true behavior type he has because he is always fix people, people's things, problems. He is learning he bases his self worth on making others better. So much to try to wrap my head around or even understand, which I can't.
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Scarlett
I have to say the story doesn't sound quite right. It's very similar to what my AP told his wife. He told her I was separated from my H and I came onto him. The truth is he promised me he was going to leave his wife, and I didn't leave my husband until AFTER he found out about the OM.

This is what they call "throwing your AP under the bus". Most of these men go into survival mode and make up whatever lies they can to save themselves. 

There is good and bad to speaking with the AP. If you're not sure your H is telling you the truth, she would be a good person to talk to. She will tell you exactly the promises he was making to keep her. Just be ready to be devastated all over again. BTW, it was my AP who said "I love you" first. 

Personally I have a problem with the way these men blame their AP, and their wives fall for the lies. You've heard the saying "it takes two to tango" and that's exactly right. Nobody is putting a gun to their heads. They are 50% responsible for what happened. Why be angry at the AP when she is not the one who made a commitment to you? 

I am aware of the actions of my AP's wife after she found out. My AP is playing a good game, blaming his wife for him stepping out on the marriage, telling her what SHE has to do to keep HIM. It's embarrassing. She is all over Facebook declaring her love for him. In all likelihood he has done it before and will do it again. I believe that because he knew exactly what to do during our A to cover his tracks, and he knew exactly what to do after the A. He even told me she would be over it in 6 months and he could come back to me. Yes I did go through a long period of time upset because I wasn't "chosen", but now that I know how he really is, I feel it is a blessing. It is his wife I feel sorry for now. 

If these men do not get help, if they don't realize they have a problem and show real remorse and a desire to change, they will do it again. He needs to be getting help on his own, not just because you make him. I don't even believe him blocking her and cutting off contact is a good clue. My AP told me that's what he was going to have to do. He already knew how to play the game. I hope all of you women have enough self worth to recognize the difference. You are not second best or in competition. It is your husband that needs to prove he is worthy enough of you. 



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Graceandhope
Scarlett-both people in the affair are 100% responsible for their actions. Both people are 100% liars the spouse has everything to lose but the other person (I won't call them a partner-they don't deserve that title) has nothing to lose, but possible something to gain. They can be looking for revenge, maybe hoping to restart something or just be an awful human.

Julie mom
Going to the other person gives them power in your life that they don't deserve. They are a blip in your life, ultimately, whether you and your spouse make it through this. She should have been someone that he acknowledged an attraction to (whether we admit it or not we all see attractions) but said sorry to. You wouldn't have even known because there would have been nothing to know! She doesn't deserve your time or energy. It can be a diversion. Focus on yourself and your marriage. If your husband is working be supporting And know that is ok. Know that there will be some days you won't have the strength to be supportive and that is ok.

For me, there were days I was angry because that was the only way to get through the day, other days I just couldn't deal with any of it anymore so I didn't and in the beginning there were lots of devastated days. Sometimes I wish I would have handled somethings different but I did it the way I knew at the time.

It does get better. Emotions will settle down and hopefully you and your husband will get help, as important talk, talk and talk some more.

Have someone to talk to.
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Kalmarjan
Graceandhope wrote:
Scarlett-both people in the affair are 100% responsible for their actions. Both people are 100% liars the spouse has everything to lose but the other person (I won't call them a partner-they don't deserve that title) has nothing to lose, but possible something to gain. They can be looking for revenge, maybe hoping to restart something or just be an awful human.



Whole heartedly agree here. The "relationship" as it were was founded on secrecy and lies, and BOTH are at fault. Unless one didn't know.
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Kalmarjan
Juliemom_2 wrote:
Thank you ALL for your insight, and understanding. I really want to work on moving forward with my husband and I but at times I don't feel I have all the answers so I feel stuck. My husband was trying to help her "fix her" to get her out of a divorce as she said her marriage was REALLY BAD. One day they were talking online and she mentioned none of the paper work was filled out yet. So my husband decided he had to go to her house to "fix it". Within five minutes of being there she was kissing him and then they had sex. Per my husband the sex lasted minutes because he felt so wrong and horrible. He stopped it and left. But the communication and her attempts to get him to sleep with her never stopped. He is normally such a clear level headed guy. How could he think going to her house would end well esp when he admits he thought sex was an option but felt he could control that and not let it happen. I can't let go of the fact in my mind he WENT there for sex. They had spoke on the phone and work (oh yeah they work together) numerous times but that day he had to go to her house to talk about her divorce. And five minutes later they are having sex yet he swears up and down that was ever his intention of going there. Maybe because my head is not in a fog I can see how unrealistic this is. He can to....NOW! But still swears it was never about sex it was always about fixing her. He is also learning in therapy this is a true behavior type he has because he is always fix people, people's things, problems. He is learning he bases his self worth on making others better. So much to try to wrap my head around or even understand, which I can't.


I completely understand the need to "fix" things. It is what makes an AP attractive to a nice guy who is used to fixing things for damsels in distress. It's part of a covert contract a nice guy makes... fix the problem and then she will be happy, therefore he will be happy. 

Honestly, IF it's true that your husband fell into this affair, and had absolutely NO idea that the opportunity for a sexual encounter would happen, (especially after she allegedly kissed him first) then either your husband is full of it, or he is the dumbest guy on the planet. 

I am not completely sure about this, but I expect that perhaps you are in the trickle truth stage now. Be on guard to hear more things over time that will hurt you even further. I may be wrong, but again, it's so typical it's like a script from a bad B movie.

I think part of the reason you are stuck is because all these parts are not adding up. It's apparent that the two of them (in the very least) were engaged in an emotional affair, so it doesn't make sense that the rest was an accident. 

If it were a case of unrequited attraction, it would have ended with a kiss, or even before that when the guy realized that she was in his space. So, don't buy the hype. There isn't a guy in this world that is that dumb. Just saying.
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Kalmarjan
Okay, time to unpack the Affair Healing Wiffle bat here. Buckle up, it's tough love time...

Scarlett wrote:
I have to say the story doesn't sound quite right. It's very similar to what my AP told his wife. He told her I was separated from my H and I came onto him. The truth is he promised me he was going to leave his wife, and I didn't leave my husband until AFTER he found out about the OM. 

This is what they call "throwing your AP under the bus". Most of these men go into survival mode and make up whatever lies they can to save themselves.


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Personally I have a problem with the way these men blame their AP, and their wives fall for the lies. You've heard the saying "it takes two to tango" and that's exactly right. Nobody is putting a gun to their heads. They are 50% responsible for what happened. Why be angry at the AP when she is not the one who made a commitment to you?


Honestly, I am not seeing any moral high ground here. Both of you are liars. Who lied more is irrelevant. Who did what first is irrelevant. One could counter that you laying blame to your AP (because he didn't live up to his promise?) is throwing your AP under the bus too.  

How can you have a problem with what your AP is doing when you are posting that your AP was the first to tell you that he loved you, said he was gonna leave his wife, that he lied to her? How does that have any bearing to you? You realize that he didn't hold a gun up to your head and make you chose to step out on your marriage either, right? YOU made that choice. Who cares what your (former) AP did? In my eyes, you're shifting blame.

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There is good and bad to speaking with the AP. If you're not sure your H is telling you the truth, she would be a good person to talk to. She will tell you exactly the promises he was making to keep her. Just be ready to be devastated all over again. BTW, it was my AP who said "I love you" first.


I personally don't think there is a point to talking to the AP, because there is nothing to verify that what she (or he) is saying is true. There are a lot of feelings in the mix, and literally no gain from that contact, other than to throw gasoline on the fire. Perhaps it is better to just not even give the AP the attention, and focus it where it matters most, your own sanity and well-being.

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I am aware of the actions of my AP's wife after she found out. My AP is playing a good game, blaming his wife for him stepping out on the marriage, telling her what SHE has to do to keep HIM. It's embarrassing. She is all over Facebook declaring her love for him. In all likelihood he has done it before and will do it again. I believe that because he knew exactly what to do during our A to cover his tracks, and he knew exactly what to do after the A. He even told me she would be over it in 6 months and he could come back to me. Yes I did go through a long period of time upset because I wasn't "chosen", but now that I know how he really is, I feel it is a blessing. It is his wife I feel sorry for now.


So, you have not gone completely no contact here. 

The thing here that bothers me here is that you still are not getting it. Who cares what your AP did, didn't do, how he justified it, whether he will do it again, whether he covered his tracks, whether you were chosen or not, whether he would "return" for you. All of that is meaningless in your story.

It's not his fault you cheated. It's yours. Period.

You thought you loved him? He duped you? Your fault. Not his. You chose to believe this, and you chose wrong.

Why are you keeping tabs on what is going on in your AP's life? It's your recovery, and this will make it harder to reconcile with your husband.

You have to let go. This is why you are having trouble getting over him, it's because you haven't completely accepted that you, and ONLY you, are responsible for your actions. Trust me, I know first hand! 

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If these men do not get help, if they don't realize they have a problem and show real remorse and a desire to change, they will do it again. He needs to be getting help on his own, not just because you make him. I don't even believe him blocking her and cutting off contact is a good clue. My AP told me that's what he was going to have to do. He already knew how to play the game. I hope all of you women have enough self worth to recognize the difference. You are not second best or in competition. It is your husband that needs to prove he is worthy enough of you. 


I totally agree with you here. By the way, where are you in this? Are you walking the walk here? It's not "these men" but "these people." It is NOT gender specific here... You cheated too, remember? What he did (or didn't do) is of no consequence in this matter, because you are no longer in a relationship with your AP.
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Scarlett
I find it interesting both Kal and Intuition said the same thing I did about pointing out the likelihood of false stories by her husband. Sorry that I can speak here from experience as the OW, but I thought that would be helpful. It's funny too, how Kal continues to get a pass on this forum, even though he's as much to blame for being a WS and continues to bash his AP like I do.

None of you know the real details of my story, or the fact that I have been in IC and MC for over a year. Yes there is anger on my part towards the OM, just like Kal has anger towards his AP. Maybe you all just don't like to hear your husbands are just as much a POS as the OW. 

I have been very clear on other posts I have no feelings towards my AP and I am still with my husband. That I have worked on myself, my marriage and have a very clear understanding what led up to the affair. Unlike some of you, I did not have a happy marriage, and my husband will be the first to admit that. 

I will bow out of this forum, since it's obvious the OW is not welcome to speak without judgment. I wish you all the best.






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Scarlett
And you're wrong, Kal. I have not spoken with my AP in a year. I was sharing information of what happened immediately following Dday, which was over a year ago. The reason I am aware of the wife's actions is because we have many mutual friends.
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Kalmarjan
Scarlett wrote:
I find it interesting both Kal and Intuition said the same thing I did about pointing out the likelihood of false stories by her husband. Sorry that I can speak here from experience as the OW, but I thought that would be helpful. It's funny too, how Kal continues to get a pass on this forum, even though he's as much to blame for being a WS and continues to bash his AP like I do.

None of you know the real details of my story, or the fact that I have been in IC and MC for over a year. Yes there is anger on my part towards the OM, just like Kal has anger towards his AP. Maybe you all just don't like to hear your husbands are just as much a POS as the OW. 

I have been very clear on other posts I have no feelings towards my AP and I am still with my husband. That I have worked on myself, my marriage and have a very clear understanding what led up to the affair. Unlike some of you, I did not have a happy marriage, and my husband will be the first to admit that. 

I will bow out of this forum, since it's obvious the OW is not welcome to speak without judgment. I wish you all the best.







And you're wrong, Kal. I have not spoken with my AP in a year. I was sharing information of what happened immediately following Dday, which was over a year ago. The reason I am aware of the wife's actions is because we have many mutual friends.


Scarlett. We're not here to pass judgement on you, more to help you see,and to help you move on from this. This is why you're here, right?

As per my situation. Hey, I may tell you straight up what my AP did, said, her actions, and such, but it is in NO way a reflection of passing blame. That's the difference between what I've seen here written by you verses what I am saying.

Me, I'm COMPLETELY responsible for my actions. They are mine, no excuses. I don't care if my AP made me feel special, if she discarded me like a fling after the sh*t hit the fan, or if she is the nicest, mother Teresa on the planet. It's all irrelevant in the end.

I had the affair. Me. I made the choice.

Fine, I was in the fog.

But, how did I get there? I had to allow that to happen.

I'm responsible.

In your case... Your AP told you he was leaving his wife. That he loved you. In fact told you it first. (Like that even matters...)

There's no judgement here, only cold, hard fact.

I can appreciate you've gone to IC, and marriage counselling. Kudos.

But, all of that is supposed to bring you to the point of understanding. It really doesn't matter WHAT your excuse is. It's all BULL.

You chose to have your affair.

All the rest is window dressing.

The faster you realize that, the quicker your recovery. You want your husband to truly heal? You really want the marriage to last through this sticky, horrible mess?

Time to buck up, and admit it. You are fully responsible.

It's time to let your AP go. Honestly, if he has gone NC for over a year, it's enough.

You know what? I'm not even angry at my AP anymore. Yes, I was at first. Really, really angry. It took a friend of mine to gently, bluntly suggest that I was holding onto anger for her, and that by doing that I was giving her too much.

Sure, there is residual anger now, but I've let go. Of almost all of it.

Why?

In order to accomplish a goal, you need to eliminate all distractions and anything that gets in the way. In my case, the goal was to remake my marriage into something stronger and better than before.

My anger, (and that is definitely still harbouring feelings for!) my AP is in the way of that.

So, you know what? Today my AP means as much to me as the grocery bagging clerk. Literally.

If I find myself slipping into daydreaming about "what could have been" or any "encounter" I had with her, I replace it with images of me and my wife together. Period. No more fantasy, obsessing, obsession, anger, bitterness, wallowing, ruminating, thinking, replaying situation, whatever.

She could bag my groceries, and I'd say thank you. That's it.

Because
...

My wife deserves ALL OF ME. I promised her that not once, not twice, but three times. (Marriage, renewal of vows, and reconciliation.)

I'm not gonna F this up.

Final note before I finish this rambling.

You getting information of any kind about your AP is a covert way of maintaining contact. Let's be real here. IF you were all-in on your marriage, - well, I have an expression that should sum up your go-to response to the information from your "helpful" friends (assuming of course you b are not searching for this information - and if you are... Then you have violated the no contact rule!)

The expression is...

Hold on a second....
I'm searching for a f*ck to give...
Searching...
Nope.i have no f*cks to give about him, what he's doing, or anything.
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