tornapart15
Hello I'm new here, unfortunately. Well I haven't shared my story but we can just chalk it up. My husband had an affair with a co-worker and I found out 6 months ago. After D-day, he continued to work there with her for 2 months. He never quit, he got fired. I was begging for him to quit and he wouldn't even look for a different job. Anyhow I would like to know what everyone thinks on giving proof that the affair has ended. He has never said in a humble sincere way that its over. Only when we argue that its brought up, he gets very angry and defensive. Then will he say its over. He has only sort of told me that him and her talked about it that "they decided to stop", I guess. But I never ever get reassurance from him on anything. That its over, he will never hurt me again, he loves me, nothing. We honestly are not good. We haven't talked about anything. We always fight, scream, leave the house. Etc. He's not remorseful. He has been working out non stop for the last 6 weeks. This was a new interest when he started the affair. The affair was ongoing for 9 months. Given his behavior, I'm not convinced he has ended it. I mean before when I confronted him about the calls and texts, he played the just friends story which I trusted him. He never called her again, he introduced me to her at his work. But he never ever ended it. I caught him at the hotel with her. Anyway am I crazy here? I need proof, reassurance that its over. Why can't he do it??? I haven't caught him again. His time is accounted for just because we are together and he's at work. There has been incidents where he won't mention he drives out to a different city 30 minutes away and not tell me, then I found out. What is going on? I need help. The other night during sex, I broke and started crying. We stopped, layed side by side while he rubbed my wrist. NOT ONE WORD!!! Pure silence other than my sobs. NO REASSURANCE!!! This was actually the 2nd time that it happened and the first time was exactly the same, he didn't say one word, no reassurance. The first time he did hold me but I need more than that. Anyway I need insight on him ending the affair. I have asked him he says yes but since he lied repeatedly its hard to trust him, especially given his actions and behavior. Did you guys get proof? What was it? How are you sure the affair has ended? This is all so terrible and confusing. Please let me know your insights to my situation, I'd appreciate it, thank you.
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Fionarob
Tornapart15 - I am so sorry to hear your story, and as a betrayed spouse myself I can relate to everything you have said.  I wish I could offer you some words of reassurance or comfort on the question of how do you know the affair has ended.  Sadly, I can't.  My experience of this is that you never know 100%, unless, after a very long period of time, the wayward spouse has been offering reassurance and proof and showing you with their behaviour, that the affair is over.

My husband would promise me over and over that the affair had ended.  He would 'prove'  with GPS apps on his 'phone his whereabouts (that I later found to be Fake GPS apps).  He would send me photos on his phone to prove where he was (that I later realised he had taken, and then gone off to meet his AP).  He did countless other things to 'prove' he was committed to me when all the time he was seeing another woman.  In other words he went to great lengths to 'reassure' me when actually he was just ensuring the affair could continue without me suspecting. 

Despite all his attempts to 'reassure' me I always had that element of doubt for one reason.  His defensive attitude.  He was very quick to get annoyed, to snap, to say he shouldn't need to constantly justify himself to me, that I made him feel like a child by having to check in with me, that I should just get over it, why did life have to be so serious etc etc.  I believe from posts I have read on this forum, that once a wayward spouse is truly remorseful and wants the marriage to work, that you would be able to tell.  Unfortunately I never felt that from my husband.

There are a lot of useful articles on this site about guarding your heart after an affair, and the type of behaviours you should be able to expect from a wayward spouse who is truly committed and has ended the affair.  Have a read of them.  They helped me a lot.  It really is the most painful experience to go through.

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Dirazz
Welcome tornapart15 I'm very sorry for all your pain. I'm am at almost a year from DD. I am the BS my husband had a short term affair with a co worker. He ended it 10 days before I found out. One of the first things I said to him was you can't work there anymore. DD was on a Sunday and he went to HR the following day and quit his job effective immediately. He told them the truth of why he had to quit. Funny thing is I texted with the OW on DD and she told me she was leaving there within a month anyway and would not talk to him anymore. Yea right! Almost a year later she's still there. Good thing I didn't take her word for it. He never had any passwords or anything like that on his electronics. They only worked together 2 days a week and other than that they communicated through a game app. Only once through regular text and that once is how I found out. I only found out about the game app because he confessed and told me. His behavior from the moment I found out was extreme remorse and wanting and willing to do whatever I asked him to do to feel safe. He came up with the idea of me putting a password on his iTunes so he couldn't add any apps to communicate with her or anybody else. He removed any and all apps like Facebook, LinkedIn or anything else where people could communicate. He also put a tracker on his phone which I have since removed because I don't feel the need for it anymore. He went and got tested for STD's even though he swears he wore a condom. But hey he was a lier I didn't trust him. That was embarrassing for him especially because he's in the health care profession and he had to tell the nurse why he was coming in for testing. It was one of those if you don't hear from us it's all good. But that wasn't good enough for me. I wanted it on paper so he went back and got written confirmation that he was good. Those are some of the things he did. He also answered any and all questions I had concerning the affair. There were nights were we stayed up all night to talk, fight hold each other and so on. He was always comforting to me. Always telling how deeply ashamed and sorry he was for his disgusting actions. And that I would not regret giving him a second chance. So I have not regretted it. He went to IC on his own, went and told our pastor what he did who then gave us the name of an amazing biblical counselor that we both went to. He still continues to reassure me that he will never be that person again and he will never let God or me down again! His words and actions are showing me how remorseful he is and now it's just a matter of time. The longer he continues it the safer I feel. I hope that helps. You deserve and should get any and all reassurances you need. That's the least he can do.
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surviving
tornapart15 - during the first 34+ years of our marriage, my husband was demeaning, angry, arrogant, etc.  When he finally admitted he was having an affair (and many other sexual sins), his anger was almost gone.  He is working on his tone and treatment of me.  Before confession, I was just his slave that he could order around, talk demeaning to, and then ignore me the other times. It wasn't a marriage at all to me, just a place to live because I had no money and no other place to go.  Now that I know anger and mistreatment comes with living a double life, I would guess that is what is happening in your life.  We even moved to another state to get away from his affairs and the memories of them.  He changed jobs because she worked as his secretary.  We are over 34 months from DDay, we have yet to reconcile.  I still have triggers (a huge one last night).  When he comes home from work and I see his face, I remember all he did in his sexual sins and I can't stand the thought of staying here.  Yet, again, I have no job, no money and no place to go.  So, I tolerate the situation the best I can.  Some days are fair, some days are horrible.  I am sorry you are going through this.  I am sorry I have to go through this.  I didn't choose this at all. It is completely his fault.  Don't ever let anyone convince you that you had anything to do with their cheating.  No matter what kind of a marriage you had, THEY chose to go outside of the marriage instead of working on the issues.  All of that doesn't make me feel any better, I still feel like second choice, the consolation prize.  If I was first in his life, there wouldn't be a need for another woman.  I don't know if that helps you or not, but what you are going through is perfectly normal for this awful situation.  
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JohnH
tornapart15 - My DD was April 13th 2016, in my limited experience learnt the hard way if there is no transparency you have to assume the worst case to protect your heart. I have been fooled a couple of times already with false returns, so I am utterly suspect. Also conflict only drove my WS further from me, I finally got a handle on myself and withdrew from that, after, communication improved and we have made some progress. Have you suggested individual or joint counselling to him?
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tornapart15
Thank you all for your help. The issue with cou! Inseling is that we need a bilingual counselor and the only one in our area we didn't like. He sat there in his chair like we were two bad kids at the principal's office. It was embarrassing and when my husband came out and said " I can't just break it off with her because she is a human being too and has feelings". Well the counselor said nothing. Not one word. And I kinda feel that counseling caters to the cheater. I never had a choice in his affair. I never had a vote. And most counseling enables the cheater to learn how to be more manipulative. So I guess what it really takes is for the cheater to look deep down inside and figure out why his morals are so terrible messed up. I will never agree that I caused him to have an affair, or take part of the blame for his affair. In fact I even confronted him years before saying how I would like him to me more affectionate with me....look what he ended up doing. I believe your marriage issues are completely separate from the cheaters affair. There are no reasons for affais, only excuses. No we weren't perfect in the marriage, thats impossible but you take responsibility and work it out. Something he decided not to do. So how could that fall back on me. It doesn't. Everyone has their own opinions.
To Fionarob....are you still with your husband? After he lied repeatedly and cheated? I'm seriously considering separating. But I need a better job to support myself. Its so hard. I need to save money but its seriously weighing heavy on my heart pretending everything is ok. Ummm HELLO NOTHING IS OK!! He just doesn't get it. Well thank you everyone, its nice to have support. I'll leave you with a hard lesson learned for me...
I've always said ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS! It's very true. And words are empty air. BUT they actually go hand in hand. Actions are nothing without words and words are nothing without actions!!! Have a good night.
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Guiltguilt
What a situation. I wouldn't be judging all counselling based on your bad experience though. I have found good counselling invaluable. You will find practical information here based on people's experiences. Good luck.
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Dirazz
tornapart15, you are right none of this is your fault! Keep looking for counseling if not for the both of you at least for you. My husbands first counselor wasn't great either. I think he had a crush on my husband. Lol he told him all the time how handsome he was. He also told him in his line of work it's expected and understandable to have affairs. What really?!! Why is your husband so concerned about "her" feelings? Out of anybody's feelings getting hurt her's should not even be considered! Your feelings as his wife should always be top priority. I can understand you just wanting to leave I really can. You have to do what's best for you. We are here to support you in whatever you decide.
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anna
It is so absurd.  This has happened to many of us.  I have come to believe that when one gets involved in an affair all his brain gets distorted.  Mine had an affair which ended up in having children (2).  I first learnt of one and he was claiming it was a one time meeting which ended in pregnancy only to hear there was a second child.  I ran mad I confronted him, the good thing I am an able woman having my money and the main supporter of the family.  Little did I know that the little money he got he used to cater for his other family.  What annoys me most is that he  blames everything on me.  He is not remorseful,  I told him since I am the wedded wife why dont you get those children from her and call it quits with her and rebuild the marriage only to ask me how would she feel as if I am concerned.  men are terrible creature is all I can say.   Counseling is good it relieves one of the pain but it cannot change anyone.  As of now I decided to keep quiet completely quiet, he comes home no sharing anything even he does not sleep in the bedroom, he stays in the living room until when is still my question?  I left him to enjoy with his wife and children, until such a time when he will come back to his senses.  Usually women who interfere with other people marriage reach a time and give up!  I trust in God for a miracle and I am happy for He has taken away all the anger I first had and I look at him as a no body in my life, not it is him who is being tortured thinking that may be I also have affairs which is actually not the case.  So my friends all I can tell you that when such happens just PRAY for the situation and also try to keep calm, I know it is not easy but when you put all in the hands of the living God who never fails things work out for the best.  I am still on my knees and I know this man will come to me one day on his knees begging for reconciliation, I hope there will still be room in my heart.
all the best.
AB
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Fionarob
tornapart15

sorry for the late reply to your question.  No I am not still with my husband.  Too much damage was done in the end and I realised that my husband was never going to end the affair.  He also showed more consideration for his AP's feelings than mine, the mother of his children and the woman who had stayed loyal despite his years of cheating.  In the end, life without him became the better option than putting up with it anymore. 

But it did take me a long time to reach that decision - I didn't want to do anything that would hurt my children and still hate the fact that I was forced into making a decision I didn't want to make.  I was also financially dependent on my husband so I have had to get a job and work out how I am going to support us.  Of course he will pay maintenance, and has agreed I can stay in the family home.  (the least he could do under the circumstances I think.) 

What it came down to in the end was his refusal to end the affair (again) over the 'phone whilst his AP was on holiday - because that would "not be a nice thing to do to her whilst she is on holiday."  That tipped me over the edge!!  That said everything I needed to hear.  That showed his complete and utter lack of respect that I had held our marriage together for 3 years and tried to heal from the pain of his cheating, whilst he continued to cheat.  In that moment I hated him so much and knew I could never forgive him for putting her above the risk of losing me and his children.
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UrbanExplorer
When it was finally over and done, as in zero contact, I told my husband about it through tears as we sat outside with glasses of wine one night. Beyond that, I just leave my phone out in the open logged in to email and social media, and I send a GPS message when leaving work because that's when I used to meet AP.

Technically, I could find a way to have contact with AP, but I really don't want to, even though he is a human being and I hope he is okay. I know I need to take responsibility for my life, and AP needs to (finally) take responsibility for his.
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Hurting13
Hi TornApart15,
I'm happy and sorry you're here. I'm happy for you to get some support, but sorry you are here in the first place.

I'm a BS. I started to really feel like it was over when my WH really showed remorse and began to listen and understand and see my pain. Up until then, he would respond to me with anger or indifference. I was able to trust that the Affair was over when he began not only reassuring me, but letting me into why he made those horrible choices in the first place. Also, when he was able to appreciate me staying with him, my loyalty to him and to our family, and to see things from my perspective, then I felt like he was really invested. He's also been 100% transparent. He shifted from being secretive and hiding things to leaving his phone out, no password or passcode. He will let me use his phone. He will show me texts and emails. He will bring home his work laptop and leave the house while logged in knowing that I can access his work email and chat history. The difference is that he understands that it is his fault that I would check up on him. In the past, he would say that I'm crazy or I'm not respecting his privacy. He understands now that me checking up on him is a direct consequence of his actions and choices. He's taking the blame. Accepting full responsibility. It feels right.

I hope you get to this point where I am now. If you don't, leave your marriage. You deserve better. Much love to you. Hang in there and take care of you!!
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