tobefree
I was wondering if it's normal for the WS treat the BS poorly while they are in an affair and that is before everything came out? 

I guess I'm trying to understand my WS behaviour during the times before I found out. Below is what happened: (long)

He told me he realized he liked her in mid-april of this year and didn't stop and kept going. It was an EA, known her for 6 months. May 22nd was our 9 year anniversary and it went well. Few days after, we had a typical argument where I felt he didn't show he cared about me or my needs. But this time he flipped. He behaved in a way that I never saw in the 10 yrs that I've known him. He ignored me, won't speak to me more than his usual self during conflicts and was extremely distance for days. He said he needs space and time to think about what he wants in his life and out relationship. He initially used the 30's life crisis as an excuse and I believed him. 

I was already aware of his friend coworker at the time but I thought they were just friends, since they work on the same team and she's engaged so I didn't think much of it. But 2 weeks after our conflict, still in the midst of his 'life crisis,' when we were watching the basketball game, he kept on msging her on WhatsApp. Now, our norm was always this: He always got annoyed and angry when I talked to him while he's watching a game, playing video games or watching a movie because he found it distracting. So our norm was, when we do this, I never talk to him. But this was one of those times, except he broke his own rule and kept on msging her. I found that really odd but didn't say anything, as I thought maybe it's part of his life crisis. I did ask him about it after the game and said, I thought you don't like to talk during these things then why msg her? He said, oh i only msged when it's break time and I thought to myself, nope, that's not what's happpening but I didn't want to get into another argument so I left it at that. We did agree that maybe during the next game we could talk a little more or maybe msg each other on a chat since he seemed to prefer that. 

On Jun 13th, he was still very distant from me and didn't talk and not like his normal self, even though I was feeling really confused and hurt, I decided that since he is having such a hard time, I wanted to cheer him up a little. So after work, I went to get his fave cupcakes and brought it to his work (wanted for him outside), even though I wasn't feeling well. I hand made a note for him to tell him that I'm here for him if he needed it and that I know he is struggling so thought the cupcakes would help. I thought when he got back home things would be better but I was wrong. When he got home, it initially was ok, He brought the cupcakes home so he could eat it with me, except he ended up eating both of them anyways. At night is where things got out of hands. We had another basketball game and we were sitting beside each other on the futon. He began msging her again but this time it was a lot. They talked non-stop and he did say 3 sentences to me but by then I was quite upset, given how the day went. He could tell I was upset and just ignored him and kept on talking to her. I think during break, I made a comment that he treats his friends better than his spouse ad I can't remember how it went down but I think it went ok. After the break, he resumed msging her non-stop until near the end of the game, which was around 11:30pm in my city. I finally broke and decided to change and walk out. He saw and just asked, where are you going in a very annoyed voice. I told him if he thinks it's appropriate to talk to his coworker non-stop while ignoring his spouse who's sitting right there? And I told him to ask his best friend if he thought that was appropriate and to ask his 'friend" (AP) if she's ok with her finacee doing that. He's reply was "it's because you are like this that's why." No remorse or anything. I just left and that was the first time I left the house and decided not to go back home. I stayed over at a friend's house. 

He didn't call me until the game was over and when he did, he was still very rude and just asked, when are you coming back? I told him I'm not because he crossed the line. While I was asking why he did what he did, I can hear him msging still so I asked if he was msging. He said yes because he didn't want to hear what I said. Conversation ended shortly. I never heard from him again. 

Later I found out (I checked his entire chat after dday) and saw that that night, even while calling me, he was all flirty and celebrating with her. How he behaved with her and me was 2 completely different human being. They chatted till 2am and put her to bed and told her good night and sweet dreams, while I was all heartbroken at my friend's place, hoping he would care but he never did. I confronted him about that and he's response was, "it was so loud outside with all the car beeping so i couldn't sleep." Justifying why it was ok to chat with her until 2am. 

There are a lot more similar actions he did along that line but this was by far the worst. Is this part of the fog? I have heard during the affair fog, they tend to focus on the bad parts of the relationship and I was wondering if overreacting to our typical or little things is part of it or if that's just my WS?

thank you!
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anthro
During her affair my wife was awful to me. Incredibly irritable, mean, unpleasant, etc. Especially early on when I guess she had to really work on justifying her conduct.

I mean, stuff as ridiculous as the sound of my footsteps being annoying. It was in parallel to how flawless and amazing her AP was.

Yes it is typical of affair behaviour. 
Formerly known as Anthropoidape... male bs, long affair, d-day Feb 2017.
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Last
Yes, typical. As the WS, I treated my husband terribly during my affair...all that anthro said above applied to me as well. I was so hurtful to him in multiple ways and regret it deeply. 
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Fionarob
Completely typical, in fact that is how I found out about my ex's first emotional affair - because of his behaviour towards me.  I hadn't done anything 'wrong', but suddenly it was like he hated me for no reason, was angry about everything and lost his temper at the slightest of things.  He was just so different from the man I knew - so it made me suspicious and I started to look for evidence, and found it easily.

On another note, I am shocked that your husband is sitting right next to you but messaging another woman, who he has already confessed as having feelings for?????  It is incredibly disrespectful.
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tobefree
Thanks for your confirmations, that is helpful. 

Fionarob, actually at the time, he didn't confess yet. It was one week before I confronted him if he had feelings for her. At the time, she was still his 'supportive good friend from work.'

Given all those terrible treatments, how do you guys work through that? Would you say those behaviours are still a reflection of who they are or it was just produced by the affair? I'm confused as to how handle those very painful treatments from him. On the one side, obviously I still love him but on the other side, I don't know if I can forgive him. It was not acceptable to me. 
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tobefree
Last wrote:
Yes, typical. As the WS, I treated my husband terribly during my affair...all that anthro said above applied to me as well. I was so hurtful to him in multiple ways and regret it deeply. 


Last, I was wondering, will it be ok if you explained why does the WS have to treat the BS partner that poorly? Also, do they tend to treat them better after the affair is out in the open or do they still hang on to the past problems? One of the things that I'm facing right post dday is that he says (just yesterday), "I am fully aware of what I did but I know how I feel and the past (our issues) hurts me so i'm not using it as a justification of what i did (affair)." Can that be true? Or is he still in the affair denial stage?
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EasyAsABC
I just wanted to add my two cents as the OW. 
I obviously can’t tell you if there were noticeable changes at home for them, but I can tell you there were noticeable changes in our relationship, from the beginning, to DDay. 
When we started seeing each other there were constant reminders that he wasn’t actually married. We rarely discussed her, and he preferred it that way. Anytime she would come up he’d brush it off like she meant nothing “I’m not in love with her”, “I’m not remotely attracted to her and I think she prefers it that way”, “I made a mistake not leaving years ago”. He led me to believe he was simply staying because she basically had become a responsibility to him, like a child might be. He was responsible for her stability, both mentally and financially. She had finally given him the child he so desperately wanted as well, so he was grateful for that, even though he acknowledged he should have had a child in a relationship he felt passionate about, not one he felt stuck in. 

And then DDay happened. 

And he went from “I don’t love her and possibly never have”, to “look at what YOU did to this innocent woman”. He changed his tune from “she’s using me” to “she’s my anchor”. And even then, would still talk to me, see me, and have sex with me behind her back. It got to the point where I was tired of the constant vilification for sleeping with him, when he was one complicit in it all along. That hypocrisy was what lead me to some clarity and inevitably gave me the strength to move on and see things for what they were. He maintained that he wasn’t in love with her until the end though, but that even though he may not feel that sense of “love” with her, that he knew his best chance at happiness was with her, not without her. 

So in the beginning, it was her fault. He was cheating because of something she lacked. 
In the end, it was my fault. He was still cheating because I couldn’t let go, and he just wanted to make me “feel happy temporarily”. 
The truth is, he’s just a cheater. He cheated before he met me, he would have cheated after DDay with someone else if he could, he’ll probably cheat again with someone else some day. The issue lies with him, and the sad part is, he pays for all this therapy, and even lies to his therapist, especially his couples therapist. 

He reached out to me this weekend, we exchanged a few texts because the one he initially sent me was pretty accusatory (not specific to the affair though). I told him I was happy and healthy and that was all he needed to know, he seemed pretty offended that I found happiness without him in my life. I told him I found happiness not to spite him, but because I refused to let him destroy me, and he had the nerve to get offended because I was “trying to make him out to be some sort of villain in all of this”. 
If that doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about the mentality of a cheater....  
BS to an abusive H 2009-2018
OW 2018-2019
I wear many hats.
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tobefree
Thank you for sharing your experience, EasyAsABC. I must admit, reading your post has been the most difficult from reading all that I have from this forum. I guess it never occurred to me what he actually told her about us or me. It hurts me to another level knowing he would tell her these types of things, while knowing what he has said to me at home about us. I am actually having a hard time typing because there is renewal sense of  extreme pain that I never knew existed. But nonetheless, I really appreciate your feedback because I needed this. I need to be able to see the full picture so I can make the best decision for myself. He sometimes is out of the fog now and I see that sometimes based on what he says. She's an engaged woman in a 8 yr relationship. He's having a harder time to believe that "I can't believe I fell for another person that is manipulative and harmful." Than what he's actually supposed to think about, which is, 'how can I be cheating and behave like this and hurt people?" He's still feeling like a victim and being hurt by me (our past) and her (for being a cheater like himself). That mentality to me is ridiculous but also very painful because I love him. I just wish he could just get what he did and impact of it all so I can feel less pain. But like you said from your post, they all have their own stuff to deal with, just like ourselves. 
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UrbanExplorer
There are multiple ways it can go before D-Day. The WS might be extra attentive to the BS or at least similar to usual to avoid raising any suspicion of an affair. Alternatively, the WS might be critical or accusatory as projection and/or to push the BS away and sort of reinforce the marital problems excuse for the affair. I think I was a bit withdrawn from my BS during my affair, but honestly, I had been like that for several years. My BS said he never suspected I was having an affair and definitely not with that person.

I'm one who avoided talking about my BS much at all to my AP. I would rather pretend I was free and on my own time when we were together. After D-Day, that all broke down.
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UrbanExplorer
EasyAsABC wrote:

He reached out to me this weekend, we exchanged a few texts because the one he initially sent me was pretty accusatory (not specific to the affair though). I told him I was happy and healthy and that was all he needed to know, he seemed pretty offended that I found happiness without him in my life. I told him I found happiness not to spite him, but because I refused to let him destroy me, and he had the nerve to get offended because I was “trying to make him out to be some sort of villain in all of this”. 
If that doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about the mentality of a cheater....  


You already know this, but stop taking the hook! Block him and don't respond. I found out about two months after going NC that my former AP had sent me hundreds (!) of direct messages on a social media platform that I rarely used. I read them and got angry and upset. He claimed that he had left his children for me and that I played him for a fool and was probably just "slumming" by having an affair with him. It was all very wrong, a rewrite of history, and I wanted badly to respond. My response was to delete the account. Problem solved. Please, do this for yourself.
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EasyAsABC


You already know this, but stop taking the hook! Block him and don't respond. I found out about two months after going NC that my former AP had sent me hundreds (!) of direct messages on a social media platform that I rarely used. I read them and got angry and upset. He claimed that he had left his children for me and that I played him for a fool and was probably just "slumming" by having an affair with him. It was all very wrong, a rewrite of history, and I wanted badly to respond. My response was to delete the account. Problem solved. Please, do this for yourself.




Oh yes, I know this well. The problem is, he and I had MANY ways to contact each other, and I keep finding out that I’ve either forgotten to block one, forgot that he had access to one, etc... 
The message this weekend I should not have responded to, because it was none of his business, but I had a missed call from an out of area area code, the SAME area code he has for all of his many numbers (they are originally not from the area they live in now, the same area I live in). So I was already on hyper alert from that, and then he messaged me because he saw that I had updated my profile a while back on the site that we initially met on, and was accusing me of basically being a liar, and he was upset that I might be sleeping with other people. Which set me off, because even if I was, it’s NONE of his business, and I just got angry and responded when I should have ignored it. 
It was a mistake, but I can’t take it back now, unfortunately. 
It really makes me ill that he acts like I’m betraying him, and even myself in some way, by potentially being with someone else after all this time. Like I’m supposed to sit at home heartbroken and full of regret for the rest of my life. 
BS to an abusive H 2009-2018
OW 2018-2019
I wear many hats.
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UrbanExplorer
Just make sure you are being honest with yourself about this. If you really want to move on and do not want contact with this guy who is harming you and involving you in harming another woman, shut it down every way you can think of. Give him less and less headspace until it's gone because you no longer feel the draw toward him.

I know well the feeling of being responsible for an AP or former AP's well-being. If we weren't people pleasers and codependents, if we knew what setting healthy boundaries felt like, we might never have allowed ourselves to get into such bad situations. 
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hurting
I find the responses from urban and easy as abc so interesting to read. Certainly they can be painful at times, but thank you both of you for taking the time to respond. Urban, my WS was like you. He withdrew, but till this day he maintains that he just didn’t talk about me or us at all. 

Tobefree, I think they’ve illustrated the issues concerning the cheating party pretty well. Generally, (not always as in Urban’s case) but certainly in yours, there is a rewriting of history. To make things that weren’t really issues into ‘reasons’ to cheat. It is all done by the cheater to JUSTIFY what they have done, so that they don’t feel like they’re the bad guy. So they don’t have to acknowledge and live with the fact that yes, they are THAT person. The scumbag. The as*hole. Selfish. Immature. Etc. 

He still wants to think of himself as some kind of ‘good’ guy... or failing that, the victim. Because of course, it can’t POSSIBLY be his fault! He made these choices only because YOU did this and SHE did that. He is not taking ownership of his poor decisions. Here is his immaturity and selfishness showing up again... he is too much of a coward to face himself. Of course it’s everyone else’s fault that he behaved like that... not his own 🙄
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tobefree
Thank you hurting, your post actually made me laugh. i think this it's the very first time I actually laughed when dealing with this issue directly so thank you! I actually didn't think it was possible, haha. I"m so glad I found this forum, as I have learned so much in just the few days I've been here. I am much calmer now, more clear headed and have a sense of control. Yes, everything still sucks but I can feel the change in myself as each day passes. Some days are worse than others but I understand that's just the norm. I know no matter how difficult it gets, I will keep going. I have to because I need to do that for myself. 

I actually showed him the graph that Tim created in another thread here (the one about how they feel about the AP and us) on the weekend. And then I told him that is what he's doing when he's saying he feels all this anger and hurt from our past. And all the ways he treated me during their affair before dday was that high. I think today it settled in a little for him, as he seems to be out of his fog for today. I think the analogy I gave him also helped. I told him if you hit someone with your car and that person is badly injured and is in the hospital. I asked him, would you really go to the hospital room and be angry with them for all the past stuff that they have done to you or would be there and support them and ask how they are doing? So I said if you know what the right thing to do is for that scenario then you know what the right thing you should do with me and this situation that you created. 
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Keepabuzz
My wife didn’t treat me well for years before her affair. Nothing abusive, she was depressed, refused help. She did the bare minimum while I was gone during the week on business trips, and left it all to me when I was home on the weekends. I did the grocery shopping, cleaned the house, went to all the kids games and activities, etc. She would sleep most of the day. During her affair, she got much worse. I could do nothing right. No matter how much I did, it was never enough, or it wasn’t done right. All this, and I was the bread winner. I make more in a month than she made all year at her “busy job”. I traveled every week for business, and still was expected to do everything around the house when I got home. I’m no push over, but I felt like maybe it was just more than she could handle. It went on for 5 months, and I just gave up. I didn’t tell her, but she sensed it quickly. All of this she told me after d-day. She knew she was losing me. I was going to leave, it was only a matter of time. She was right. I was done.  She ended her affair and tried her best to be “super mom and super wife” but I wasn’t buying it. After about a month, she confessed and destroyed me. 

About a week after d-day, looking back I was still in some form of shock. I was sitting in our bathroom floor in full meltdown mode. She walked in and said “You’re just feeling sorry for yourself”. The tone in her voice was emotionless, cold. That statement is seared into my soul. Looking back, it’s a good thing that I was still in shock and reeling. If the rage had fully kicked in by that time, I don’t know what I might have done. Her cruelty has left some of my deepest wounds. 

Cruelty is sadly par for the course.  
Male BS, D-day July 2015, trying to stay out of the dark.....
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