anthropoidape
It goes without saying that having an affair is weak and selfish, because if you are unhappy enough to have an affair, there are lots of things you can do (including leaving), and you would do one of those other things if you were not weak and selfish. 

I can't get away from the idea that a WS who stays after d-day is also weak and selfish. What such a person is doing is making it their spouse's responsibility if the relationship ends. And if their spouse is selfless or vulnerable enough to live with it, then the WS is consigning them to a life with someone who has not loved them well and properly, a life that will be ridden with distrust, a life that will never feel better than just okay. By staying, the WS is denying the spouse they betrayed the opportunity to live a better and happier life without them. 

If a WS had any courage (and I guess it is basically a given that they lack this) then wouldn't they say, "I know you want to try, but it would be selfish of me to let you. You deserve to start over, and the sooner the better."
Maybe it is okay, maybe it will be okay.

BS, d-day Feb 2017, 16 mth affair.
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jmh78
If the WS does what you’re suggesting, an alternate view is that they are continuing to make unilateral decisions about a relationship that involves two people.
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Fionarob
The betrayed spouse has a lot of say in the situation too.  If they don't want the WS to stay then they don't have to live that life.  If the BS feels they want the chance to start over and go and find a new partner, then that's exactly what they can do.

I don't think a WS who decides to stay and work at their marriage is weak or selfish at all.  I think it is very difficult for the WS to stay and live with what they have done.  I think anyone who decides to stay and try and rebuild their marriage is actually very brave.  They know their affair and the choices they made will be part of their marriage history forever.  I also believe it is not an easy thing for many WS to walk away from their AP and leave a path of destruction behind them.  (I am not saying I have sympathy for them, just seeing it from their viewpoint.)

What is selfish and weak is the WS who stays in the marriage but continues the affair.  The ones that can't have the courage to make a choice either way, they are the ones who are weak and selfish.
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arizons
anthropoidape wrote:
making it their spouse's responsibility if the relationship ends. 

I know exactly how you feel on this one. After D-day and the months after D-day that my WS continued the affair and turned into the Mr. Hyde... he would start fights and often tell me things like, "Why don't you let me leave? Why don't you let me go?... etc etc" My answer was, "YOU can leave anytime you want, your an adult and I won't stop you, there is the door...But know this... YOU leave because YOU are choosing to leave....That decision is on YOU! not me. I won't be the one to throw you out or end things to give you justification that you can point at me being the one to end things....THIS IS ALL ABOUT YOU! YOUR ACTIONS, YOUR BAD CHOICES!"

I also agree with Fionarob, the most painful months was that he actually continued the affair for months in front of my face. He didn't hide the fact that he was leaving the house to see her, talk with her, work on her car...etc etc etc. Which only made it more painful because of the harassment from the AP as well.

At one point my husband made it clear that he didn't want to leave me or a divorce but wanted to be with both me and the AP! and I said "NO WAY!" but in all reality he was with both of us for that time. 

But now...often I wonder the motives of why my husband stayed with me. He says he loves me...but I have to wonder. I am the bread winner and although we are far from rich or wealthy, I provide a comfortable life where all of our basic needs are met and we are comfortable. Something that the AP was either unable to provide or unwilling...maybe both, as she couldn't even afford to live on her own, had no job and was in and out of rehabs.

I think in their wayward minds, if we are the one that calls it quits or kicks them out...it justifies their actions or decisions in some way (in their mind anyway).
Female BS, D-day 1/03/2017, 
I'm going to rebuild me like a remix,

and raise my soul like a Phoenix 
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Trinity
I agree with Fionarob that I believe it to be brave to stay and work things out.  Both parties surely know that it is going to be a difficult road ahead and choosing to go on that road together is, for sure, a brave decision.  
BS - DDay July 2017

O GOD, take me, break me, make me. 
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Jennifer
Fionarob wrote:


I don't think a WS who decides to stay and work at their marriage is weak or selfish at all.  I think it is very difficult for the WS to stay and live with what they have done.  I think anyone who decides to stay and try and rebuild their marriage is actually very brave.  They know their affair and the choices they made will be part of their marriage history forever.  I also believe it is not an easy thing for many WS to walk away from their AP and leave a path of destruction behind them.  (I am not saying I have sympathy for them, just seeing it from their viewpoint.)

What is selfish and weal is the WS who stays in the marriage but continues the affair.  The ones that can't have the courage to make a choice either way, they are the ones who are weak and selfish.


Very well said Fionarob. I agree that it takes a lot of bravery and courage to own one's mistakes and step up to learn and grow from what they did. To fully show remorse and deal with the shame and guilt they face cannot be easy. There is always a choice to leave if that is what they want. 

I agree as well that it is more selfish to stay in both relationships knowing they are continuing to hurt people. Especially if they are staying just because they don't want to be the "bad guy" to end the relationship. Life is rarely so cut and dry and one person's motives and reasons for staying or going can look very different from someone else's who has been in an affair.
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JKoloseik
I don't know how to respond to this conundrum. A year later, and even though he left her, he has not taken responsibility for anything. I was the one who fought. I was the one who wouldn't leave. I was the one who finally forced him to decide. I was the one who kept catching him afterwards texting her and receiving her pictures... and sending them. He never took responsibility. Yes, I believe he has been extremely selfish, because he hasn't had to take responsibility... Right down to: we moved to get away, rather than him having the strength to stop. I moved away from my family to fix this marriage, but I thought he would try. I really did. Now I just want to go home. I miss my family, and I am growing more and more disgusted around him... after a year. Why isn't it getting better? I thought it would. But everything feels like a game. Nothing seems real. I don't want to try anymore, and sometimes my depression overcomes me so hard that I don't want to face the morning.
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Keepabuzz
From what you have said, you have given him many more chances than I would have given my wife. If he, even after a year, refuses to take responsibility for his actions, you may want to look into options of separating yourself from him. 
Male BS, D-day July 2015, trying to stay out of the dark.....
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JKoloseik
That is where the exhaustion comes in. From Northern US to Southern US, from hurricane to desert. Now face the fact that I probably shouldn't have gotten on this roller coaster and just stayed home where people love me... for real. I would have to move again. I am so tired.
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Keepabuzz
You will find kindred spirits here walking the same path you are. Some at different points, some at the same. 
Male BS, D-day July 2015, trying to stay out of the dark.....
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Trinity
JKoloseik wrote:
That is where the exhaustion comes in. From Northern US to Southern US, from hurricane to desert. Now face the fact that I probably shouldn't have gotten on this roller coaster and just stayed home where people love me... for real. I would have to move again. I am so tired.

I Echo your exhaustion.  For me, it is the hardest road I have traveled and the crappiest cards I have ever been dealt.  I still keep keeping on.  I do it because I have faith, morals, values, love, grace and forgiveness.  Perhaps a better hand [smile]
"T" 
BS - DDay July 2017

O GOD, take me, break me, make me. 
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JKoloseik
Thank you
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Trinity
JKoloseik wrote:
Thank you

Keep visiting here.  I have found more support and healing here then anywhere else.  
"T"
BS - DDay July 2017

O GOD, take me, break me, make me. 
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Anna26
JKoloseik wrote:
I don't know how to respond to this conundrum. A year later, and even though he left her, he has not taken responsibility for anything. I was the one who fought. I was the one who wouldn't leave. I was the one who finally forced him to decide. I was the one who kept catching him afterwards texting her and receiving her pictures... and sending them. He never took responsibility. Yes, I believe he has been extremely selfish, because he hasn't had to take responsibility... Right down to: we moved to get away, rather than him having the strength to stop. I moved away from my family to fix this marriage, but I thought he would try. I really did. Now I just want to go home. I miss my family, and I am growing more and more disgusted around him... after a year. Why isn't it getting better? I thought it would. But everything feels like a game. Nothing seems real. I don't want to try anymore, and sometimes my depression overcomes me so hard that I don't want to face the morning.


You could be speaking for me.  3 plus years after I discovered the affair we are still living apart.  And that's because he carried on seeing her, texting her and not taking any responsibility and I wasn't about to tolerate that from my own doorstep. Fast forward and I think things have fizzled out.  But he seems to not know what to do.  He'd even spoken about moving away, either on his own or with me, for a completely fresh start.  Why would I want to do that, to leave all my support network, my home, job and family, on what seems to be a whim with no backup of commitment and responsibility towards me.  I really think that he thinks it would be okay and just all blow over.  But it won't because he just can't get his head round the fact that it's the lack of trust and commitment that holds everything back.  And I'm not going to put the words in his mouth, he has to figure it out for himself.  Trouble is, he has always been unable to express his feelings, preferring to stuff it all down and deal with it in his own way.  If he came to me and said, I'm sorry, I've been a fool, and I've come to a decision, that would help, but he doesn't.  So I soldier on as I am.  In essence, we have to forge ahead with our own lives and if they want to be with us, they should move towards that. But without that kind of commitment, we need to look after ourselves first.
And I'm not about to jump out of the frying pan into the fire. 
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UrbanExplorer
Standing together in the ashes of nuclear destruction of a relationship instead of starting fresh is brave of any BS or WS. 
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