Valntine66

I haven't found this topic but then again it may be addressed elsewhere. But just by the topic title alone, don't I have a right?

 I am open and honest with my BS. I tell her where I go, who I talk with, every detail about me and my whereabouts, passwords, logs, open computers, you name it, but she expresses she does NOT care. At least my adult children are grateful I tell them and if my plans change, such as if I take a detour, I tell them of the detour.  But when I ask my wife where she's going or what is she doing she just gives me one of 3 answers: 1) errands, 2) somewhere, 3) none of your business.

 I get it, I am the WH, estranged, and broke the trust in her.  But how can I develop that trust to her if she cares not to see where I am or where I am going.  I even said that she has access to my calendar and I put EVERYTHING on my calendar so that she knows where I am at and what time.  So I ask, don’t I have a right to know where she is going or doing?

Val
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Kalmarjan
lleckron wrote:

I haven't found this topic but then again it may be addressed elsewhere. But just by the topic title alone, don't I have a right?

 I am open and honest with my BS. I tell her where I go, who I talk with, every detail about me and my whereabouts, passwords, logs, open computers, you name it, but she expresses she does NOT care. At least my adult children are grateful I tell them and if my plans change, such as if I take a detour, I tell them of the detour.  But when I ask my wife where she's going or what is she doing she just gives me one of 3 answers: 1) errands, 2) somewhere, 3) none of your business.

 I get it, I am the WH, estranged, and broke the trust in her.  But how can I develop that trust to her if she cares not to see where I am or where I am going.  I even said that she has access to my calendar and I put EVERYTHING on my calendar so that she knows where I am at and what time.  So I ask, don’t I have a right to know where she is going or doing?



Quick question. Why?

I'm asking because maybe if you step back, and examine it, would it be you upset at having to be completely open about your whereabouts, but your wife doesn't have the same restriction? Perhaps you view it as unfair? After all, why do you have to be completely open, but she doesn't have that restriction at all? Does it seem unfair?

I understand. I get where you are coming from.

But it's all new. Think on this for a minute. She didn't cheat. You did. Is that fair? Is it fair that she has to set that aside to see if things work out with you? Is it fair that every time she looks at you she sees you in the arms of someone else, and has to imagine you in the throes of sexual intercourse with someone else?

How about is it fair that you promised her to be true to her, and. You. Lied. To her face. You broke that vow. Slapped her trust right in the face.

I also thought like you.

Until. I asked the questions above.

Suddenly it doesn't seem all that unfair.

I challenge you. Look at another perspective. Despite you cheating and treating your wife (and your relationship) like garbage, she is still giving you a chance to work things out, even if it's completely unfair to her.

Your fairness meter pales in comparison. You've a chance to make it up to her. Don't blow that chance over an unjustified sense of entitlement for a benefit of the doubt you don't deserve.

Not trying to be harsh, but I'm a WS who's been there. It's the truth as I see it.

Good luck.
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Survivingbyfaith
Hey lleckron,
I, like you, created the same situation. I would like to say just a couple of things.

One, what we did should never define who we are. Yes what we did was a horrible disgusting despicable act. We betrayed our spouse and shook them to their very core!!!

Two, we have basic rights that should be afforded to all. Just as we didn't have the right to do what we did, our BS shouldn't take the opportunity to go against the bible too. A sin is a sin. I don't buy into the fact that since we committed this act, we should be treated like gum on the bottom of someome's shoe. I do agree that we owe every ounce of energy we have to creating an environment where our BS feel safe and secure!! In the grand scheme of things, finding the grace of God is always first. At this point, the only thing I can say is that you remain faithful to God and continue trying to rebuild the foundation of your relationship. At every moment she gives you to show her that you are remorseful, take it.

Lastly, one of the best things my BS and I received in our biblical counseling is the fact that yes she has every right to be angry and say what she feels like, but don't take it because anger is an open road for Satan to attack. Give everything to God!!

Not my place to judge, but I wonder why the pastor is seeing you separately? Our biblical based counselor only would see us together. He never let my BS sulk like she's a victim. We asked him about that one day. He said that she is in charge of her emotions. In the scheme of things, no one is in charge of our emotions but us. If we choose to live in our fleshly bodies, it will only lead to Satan's delight. If it's ok with you, I'd like to keep you in my prayers?



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Valntine66
Kalmarjan wrote:
Quick question. Why? I'm asking because maybe if you step back, and examine it, would it be you upset at having to be completely open about your whereabouts, but your wife doesn't have the same restriction? Perhaps you view it as unfair? 


Unfair, no.  I find it that I am putting the work into it and she does not take advantage to it.  Yet, I still let her know where I am.  I want to be accountable to her and my kids to show how serious I am about this restoration

Kalmarjan wrote:
Think on this for a minute. She didn't cheat. You did. Is that fair? Is it fair that she has to set that aside to see if things work out with you? Is it fair that every time she looks at you she sees you in the arms of someone else, and has to imagine you in the throes of sexual intercourse with someone else? How about is it fair that you promised her to be true to her, and. You. Lied. To her face. You broke that vow. Slapped her trust right in the face. I also thought like you. Until. I asked the questions above. Suddenly it doesn't seem all that unfair.


I agree with you.  It was unfair for me what I did.  I cheated, I broke my vows, I was in bed with another woman, I did the damage, now I have to do the work.  And I am willing to do the work.  I know its unfair for her.  that is why I do all my complaining in my room (and on here).

Kalmarjan wrote:
I challenge you. Look at another perspective. Despite you cheating and treating your wife (and your relationship) like garbage, she is still giving you a chance to work things out, even if it's completely unfair to her. Your fairness meter pales in comparison. You've a chance to make it up to her. Don't blow that chance over an unjustified sense of entitlement for a benefit of the doubt you don't deserve. Not trying to be harsh, but I'm a WS who's been there. It's the truth as I see it. Good luck.


Thank you for challenge.  My pastor and kids tell me the same thing and it is encouraging that she has not filed for divorce and working with me in our Deaf ministry and talking.  I guess EVERY couple is different in their relationship and working on the marriage.
Val
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UrbanExplorer
Our discernment counselor proposed that we set boundaries together if we decide to fully work on the marriage. Thus, if cell phones are open for examination by the spouse, it goes for both people. However, that kind of agreement happens down the road, after the WS has already done the initial transparency work to make the BS feel safe. Letting each other know whereabouts is common courtesy in relationships, but since you are presently separated, I don't know that it applies. I would not press her for that right now.
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Heidi
I'm agreeing with Urcan all over the place today. My WS has the password to everything. I regularly leave my phone / iPad around to be transparent. But it's nothing he's asked for, it's something I willingly give him because he does the same for me. If he'd have asked for it in the early stages (when yes, I was checking his stuff) that would have angered me, because I was not the one who broke our trust.

It's early days for you, and I can feel the pain you're going through right now. Remember this is a marathon not a sprint. Baby steps are what's needed.
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Valntine66
UrbanExplorer wrote:
Our discernment counselor proposed that we set boundaries together if we decide to fully work on the marriage. Thus, if cell phones are open for examination by the spouse, it goes for both people. However, that kind of agreement happens down the road, after the WS has already done the initial transparency work to make the BS feel safe. Letting each other know whereabouts is common courtesy in relationships, but since you are presently separated, I don't know that it applies. I would not press her for that right now.


I'm not pushing it. I make myself open and available whenever she asks. Like I said before, she has access to my calendars online my phone my emails my passwords I hide nothing
Val
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Keepabuzz
Survivingbyfaith wrote:

Quote: Hey lleckron,
I, like you, created the same situation. I would like to say just a couple of things.

One, what we did should never define who we are. Yes what we did was a horrible disgusting despicable act. We betrayed our spouse and shook them to their very core!!!

Two, we have basic rights that should be afforded to all. Just as we didn't have the right to do what we did, our BS shouldn't take the opportunity to go against the bible too. A sin is a sin. I don't buy into the fact that since we committed this act, we should be treated like gum on the bottom of someome's shoe. I do agree that we owe every ounce of energy we have to creating an environment where our BS feel safe and secure!! In the grand scheme of things, finding the grace of God is always first. At this point, the only thing I can say is that you remain faithful to God and continue trying to rebuild the foundation of your relationship. At every moment she gives you to show her that you are remorseful, take it.

Lastly, one of the best things my BS and I received in our biblical counseling is the fact that yes she has every right to be angry and say what she feels like, but don't take it because anger is an open road for Satan to attack. Give everything to God!!

Not my place to judge, but I wonder why the pastor is seeing you separately? Our biblical based counselor only would see us together. He never let my BS sulk like she's a victim. We asked him about that one day. He said that she is in charge of her emotions. In the scheme of things, no one is in charge of our emotions but us. If we choose to live in our fleshly bodies, it will only lead to Satan's delight. If it's ok with you, I'd like to keep you in my prayers?

________________________________________________________________________________________________

I have to disagree with your thought process of "We all have basic rights" etc etc. YOU broke YOUR vows to your BS! YOU violated your BS's basic rights to not be treated like garbage, not get an STD, not be lied, deceived, and gaslighted over and over again. What about their rights? When you do terrible things, there are consequences. That is just reality. If you were to go to prison for a crime, some of your rights are taken away. You have made your BS sacrifice more than you will ever know, but you don't think you shouldn't have to sacrifice to help heal the wound?

I'm not sure I understand another one of your comments. You were told by your biblical counsellor that she has every right to be angry, and say what she feels like, but "not" to take her anger? I really hope I misunderstood what you meant. If a counseulor told me that, I think he may be missing some teeth! If she doesn't let the anger out, it will eat her alive.
Male BS, D-day July 2015, trying to stay out of the dark.....
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Valntine66
Keepabuzz wrote:
Survivingbyfaith wrote:

I have to disagree with your thought process of "We all have basic rights" etc etc. YOU broke YOUR vows to your BS! YOU violated your BS's basic rights to not be treated like garbage, not get an STD, not be lied, deceived, and gaslighted over and over again. What about their rights? When you do terrible things, there are consequences. That is just reality. If you were to go to prison for a crime, some of your rights are taken away. You have made your BS sacrifice more than you will ever know, but you don't think you shouldn't have to sacrifice to help heal the wound?

I'm not sure I understand another one of your comments. You were told by your biblical counsellor that she has every right to be angry, and say what she feels like, but "not" to take her anger? I really hope I misunderstood what you meant. If a counseulor told me that, I think he may be missing some teeth! If she doesn't let the anger out, it will eat her alive.


Keepabuzz

I understand where you're coming from about basic rights, do we have them? No human being should be treated the way a BS should be treated because you're right, they were lied to, violated, treated like garbage. The betrayed spouse is now angry and has to heal, and I know part of that healing is allowing that anger to be expressed towards the WS. Yet, as a Christian we look at things through biblical perspective. Yes healing does have to take place and every biblical counselor, Christian counselor, sees things differently. Even when I gave biblical counseling to some of the couples in our church that cheated on each other I constantly spoke about grace and forgiveness and mercy but I understood the anger was still there from the BS. I never told a BS don't express your anger because I knew that was part of it. But I also give it vice to give it to God.

But now four days ago I sit on the side of the fence as a BS because my wife had an affair with the pastor we were seeing. So I get the pain, anger, feel like garbage, the gut wrenching feeling of being betrayed, images, being lied to, while restoring our marriage. My BS has been willing to work the marriage for her first three months then it changed in the last two months and now I know why. I am angry, I am crying throughout the day and I cry myself to sleep at night because now I am the BS. But the one thing that I am not going to do is I am not going to react like the way my wife did to me because she doesn't deserve that and neither does the pastor. I am extending mercy, grace, compassion, and kindness, So my rights of being angry and violent and vindictive and hostile, I'm waving those rights and just giving it to God

Val
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Dirazz
We too went to a biblical counselor like survivingbyfaith and I was consumed by my anger and pain and needed to be told that I had every right to yell and scream, but after months of doing so I wasn't healing only getting angrier. Once I changed my mindset and somehow got validation that yes I did have every right to be angry. guess that's all I needed? I have to say it was truly the Grace God showed me how to give to my husband that changed everything.
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Keepabuzz
I'm not sure the word anger truly encompasses the way I felt on D-Day and honestly for months after that day. It was blinding, tunnel vision, all encompassing rage, truly rage. Months after D-day, I had better control of it, but was still there. I had a run in with some college age guys cat calling my daughter. My reaction really scared me, albeit hours after the incident. The was no decision I made on how to deal with them, it was 100% pure reaction, tunnel vision rage. Thankfully they did not want to deal with me, and quickly left. Later I thought, what if they hadn't? What would I have done? I certainly didn't have a hint of control of myself. It was definitely a wake up call for me.

I read some books on anger management, and really got down to the truth. Hurt, that's it just terribly hurt masked that with anger and rage. I am better now at recognizing it and catching myself, but I would be lying if I said there isn't anger about her affair. I'm sure there always will be. But it has gotten easier.
Male BS, D-day July 2015, trying to stay out of the dark.....
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Valntine66
I too am not going to lie, I'm angry, furious, raged at what took place. I need down in bed and I actually rehearse in my own mind statement I just want to Yellit my wife. The same kind of statements that she was so violent with me and I did let her express her anger and violent words with me. And then after I'm rehearse them in my mind about one maybe two minutes the Holy Spirit convicts my heart and reminds me to just give it to God and trust in him because he is the comforter.

Anger is a normal emotion but most often we use it wrong.
Val
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sunflower07
Valntine66 wrote:
I too am not going to lie, I'm angry, furious, raged at what took place. I need down in bed and I actually rehearse in my own mind statement I just want to Yellit my wife. The same kind of statements that she was so violent with me and I did let her express her anger and violent words with me. And then after I'm rehearse them in my mind about one maybe two minutes the Holy Spirit convicts my heart and reminds me to just give it to God and trust in him because he is the comforter.

Anger is a normal emotion but most often we use it wrong.


Val,

I think your wife had a revenge affair. Seems that happens but it still has to hurt.

I'm appalled that the pastor got involved with her. I'm sorry, but I really feel men of the cloth are held to a higher standard!!!

Maybe you felt that way about yourself too?


What is wrong with our nation right now? I know that there are some here from other countries too.

But it seems like America is just rushing into moral decay. I'm disheartened about the amount of infidelity there is and also how depressing everything is in the news right now.

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