despairwh
Sorry... I have to remove this post... you know why...
Quote 0 0
Vanessa
After 24 years of marriage you're thinking she should be "over it" in a couple of months? It is way too early to determine if this "marriage" can be saved. 

You risked her health and financial future by sleeping with/paying for prostitutes for YEARS.  That is a LOT to take in.  And process.  If you are ready to give up after a couple of months I think you have no idea of how deeply you have hurt her. 

And the reason she doesn't believe you about the ring is because you LIED to her.  For YEARS.  She would be an idiot to believe you if you said the sky was blue. 

Glad you are in counseling, but this is a very long road and you only actually start on that road when ALL of the stuff is out in the open.
I wish you luck - it won't be easy.
Quote 5 0
FanofMike2020

despairwh, 

OH WHAT A TANGLED WEB WE WEAVE WHEN FIRST WE PRACTICE  TO DECEIVE!!!
Sir Walter Scott

As I‘m reading your post, I’m sobbing feeling so bad for your wife going through this awful life changing experience that she certainly didn’t ask for or deserved.  I wish I could give her a hug.  She probably wishes you were dead, but even that wouldn’t take the pain away.  You may get an “A” for being a successful executive, but you certainly get an”F” in the treatment of those you supposedly hold most dear—your family.  At the end of your life, you’re not going to say, “I wish I had worked more”, or “I wish I had spent more time with prostitutes.”  You are going to be saying, “I wish that I had spent more time with my family.”  It proves that it doesn’t matter how much money you make, how big of a house you have, or how many cars you have.  The most important things in your life are the relationships with your wife and children.  Not how many women you had sex with, or how many sexual fantasies you participated in.

I’ve watched many videos on Affair Recovery.  Samuel had a 2 1/2 year affair, but managed to keep his family intact with lots of therapy.  Anyway, Samuel was telling his client about what had happened to him, and how he was struggling with lack of money.  How he had been on top of the world.  He had lots of money, big house, and lots of friends.  After his affair became known, Samuel lost his job, friends were gone, lost his house, and they had to move to Texas to get away from his affair partner.  Samuel’s client, who was super rich and powerful, after learning that Samuel had kept his family together, told Samuel that he would give up everything penny he had to have his family back.  There had been infidelity, and he and his wife were divorcing.  The client told Samuel that if both men were to magically switch lives, Samuel would never have to worry about money ever again.  But then, Samuel would not have his family, and the other guy would.  So sad what infidelity does to people.

 This always reminds me of that song called, “Cat’s in the cradle.”  The song is about a busy man who never has time for his son.  Then when the son grows up, the son never has time for his father.  So, the son grew up exactly like his dad.  Despairwh, you should definitely listen to that song if you haven’t already.  It will give you a perspective on how you spend your time.  Your children need to spend time with you, but you are giving away your time to strangers.  Your precious time should not be spent with prostitutes who don’t give a damn about you other than getting your money.  That’s no relationship to be proud of.

I feel like I have to ask you,”Are you a narcissist?”  As I’m reading this post, I get the impression that you don’t want your wife to make YOU feel bad for what YOU did to HER.  An example of this is when you say that your wife is “trying to aggravate me to the point that I give up on the M and get a D.”  You don’t want to feel bad for what you did.  You should feel bad for hurting her.  If you don’t, you’ve got bigger problems.  You also say that you are “getting more and more depressed and exhausted.”  How the heck do you think your wife feels?  She is also AGGRAVATED, DEPRESSED, and EXHAUSTED by what YOU did to HER.   She didn’t get a say in your cheating.  That was your choice.  You chose to put yourself in this predicament.  So don’t play the victim.  This is your new reality.  You may not like your new reality that you created, but there it is nonetheless.  One of the many consequences cheaters have to face.

My first suggestion is for you and your poor, poor wife to definitely get tested for ALL STDs ASAP.  Heaven only knows if you are infected with something.  You could very well have killed your wife.  Your children would be fatherless and motherless—orphans.  Who is going to take care of them?  Some STDs like Chlamydia can be asymptotic and only discovered through testing.  You better hope that you didn’t pass on an STD on to your wife.  Another consequence of cheating.

The fact that you were unfaithful with a prostitute is beyond pathetic.  Why would you feel the need to have to pay for someone to have sex with you to show you love and attention that you don’t deserve?  You have a wife who loves you who would be more than glad to show you her love for you.  So, not only were you physically unfaithful but financially unfaithful as well.  I can only imagine how much money you spent on services rendered, hotels, meals, and gifts that you did not give to your wife because you were busy giving those things to others.  You were also unfaithful with your time.  Time that you withheld not only from your wife but also your children.  Time that you can never get back.  Your children were probably wondering why you were not at home.  Who was more important than them? REMEMBER—-Cat’s in the cradle.  I’d hate to be in your shoes when you have to answer that question.

The ring thing—-YIKES!!!  I’m surprised you’re still alive.   The fact that you don’t comprehend why she is so upset because of the ring, says you have no empathy or compassion towards your wife.  I can only imagine how upset she was with you.  Her heart rate must have been well over 100 beats a minute.  She probably has PTSD from all this trauma you inflicted.  No wonder she rages.  If she doubts your truthfulness about the ring,  you only have yourself to blame for lying. 

If you had unmet needs, there were other options—leave, divorce, see a therapist, sit and have a conversation. Choosing to have an affair was the most FUN (for you), but definitely (for your wife) the most hurtful and damaging thing to do not to mention cowardly.  

Yes, cowardly.  Instead of being a real MAN, you chose to put your wife through the worst pain imaginable.  Judge Judy says that when someone knows what they are going to do is wrong, and they do it anyway, those people are being self-indulgent.  You knew what you were doing was wrong, or you would not have kept it a secret for so long.  Affairs are about keeping secrets.  Secrets that only you and your prostitute companion only knew about.  I hope you told your wife EVERY LITTLE DETAIL about your affair.  Two years is a long time to be deceitful.  When you complain that she is raging at you and it seems like a long time to you, I have to ask, “ Are you kidding me?  Do you really think that she should get over the fact that you stabbed her in her back and twisted the knife just for extra fun?”  When she found out about the ring, it reset the healing process.  You don’t get to dictate how long she gets to heal.  It takes however long it takes.  She had no say in how long you had your affair.  You also don’t mention if you confessed about the affair, or if you were found out.  Being caught is the worst.

I can see how she would be embarrassed to have people know your true character.  She chose you because she thought that out of all the millions of men in this world, she thought you were a man of honor.    And look how well that turned out.  She is questioning her judgement of how she could have been fooled by you into thinking you were a stand up guy. A person with good morals and values.  You fooled her completely, and she feels like an idiot.  She’s facing the reality that you were actually a fraud.

I hope she understands with therapy that your affair had nothing to do with her (although it feels like it is.)  Your affair is all about your brokenness and how shallow you are.  You are hallow on the inside. People who are hallow on the inside have nothing to offer others except pain and suffering. Your wife was wonderfully and fearfully made by God, and no one can diminish her self worth.  It will take her time to understand this. Your affair does not take away what a wonderful person she is on the inside.   You broke her, and it’s your job now to fix what you broke.  And don’t complain because you have to fix what you broke.  You are and will continue facing a tsunami of hurt and rage from her due to your careless and thoughtless actions.  Man up because it’s going to be a bumpy ride.  It’s hard facing the consequences of your actions.  I bet you wish you had never cheated in the first place.  Your happy life has now become a nightmare.

You say that you are getting depressed because she rages at you.  You have some nerve.  You certainly weren’t “depressed” when you were in the arms of strangers.  

God hates adultery so much that he mentioned it twice in the Ten Commandments:
1.  Thou shall not commit adultery.
2.  Thou shall not covet they neighbor’s wife.
I’d hate to be in your shoes when you will have to defend yourself to him.

Affairs are about escaping real life.  Instead of being a REAL MAN and talking to your wife about life’s struggles ( which we all have), you chose to escape and have others tell you how wonderful you are.  Praise that you did not deserve.  A counselor once said that in her 30 years of counseling couples, more often than not, it’s the spouse that cheats that is putting the least amount of effort in the relationship.  Were you telling your wife how wonderful she is, or how sexy she is, or that you would like to fulfill a “sexual fantasy” with her?  Probably not.  You were failing your marriage because you were with affair partners and never home.  Hard to work on your marriage when your body and mind were with APs.

Some unfaithful guy posted on another website that he wishes he had gone to his wife and told her “ I feel lonely”.  If he had done this and gotten his wife’s attention, he would not be going through the hell he is in right now.

The ones I really worry about are your children.  They are the unintended victims of your adultery.  As a child, my father had affairs.  It still affects my sisters and me to this day.  My sister loathes him for what he did to us and especially our mother who I used to hear crying behind closed doors.  It was very embarrassing having him for a father knowing we were the talk of the town.  If your children find out about your affairs, they will probably be embarrassed having you for their father.  I don’t know how this knowledge will affect them.  It’s hard to keep affairs from becoming public.  These things have a way of coming out eventually.  Sometimes affairs affect employment, damage your reputation, lose friends, lose respect from loved ones, etc.

Have you thought that your wife might have a revenge affair?  It does happen a lot.  More than people imagine.  So, you could be looking at your own DDay.  Just saying.


A lady posted on Affair Recovery that to this day she carries a heaviness in her heart not only for the pain she inflicted on her ex husband, but for the pain she inflicted on her own children.  The children she carried within her.  The children that she nursed and raised were the ones she hurt the most.  To this day, years later, she still sees how her infidelity has affected her own children.  What she wouldn’t give to be able to go back in time and undo the affair, but she knows she can’t.  She also said that there is not one person on this Earth worth hurting your own family.

So, I ask you, despairwh, was that prostitute worth all the pain you inflicted on your family?  

THE CHICKENS HAVE COME HOME TO ROOST!!!

 

Quote 2 0
ThrivenotSurvive
Despairwh -

I have good news and I have bad news.  

The good news is that if there is hope for your marriage.  You do seem to take full responsibility for what you've done and don't seem to display at lot of the defensiveness that many WS do.  In addition, you do not seem to have been emotionally involved with the prostitute(s) which eliminates one of many hurdles to a successful reconciliation.  

But here's the bad news.  It is going to take YEARS, not months for your wife to heal.  My husband and I are 4 years out from DD and are really happy with each other and our life together again.  But the first year after DD was sheer hell.  The next year was in cycles.  Cycles of seeming normalcy - and then something would trigger me and I'd go down the rabbit hole of distrust, fear, self-protection, anger, depression.... all over again.  My husband had to weather these with me when often he'd done NOTHING to trigger them.  The third year was when it FINALLY started to really gel.  My nervous system had finally started to heal, the PTSD symptoms had become rare and my trust in my husband's intentions and ability to protect me from harm (rather than be the bearer of it) had finally begun to return.   

But this was only possible because my husband was steadfast in his approach.  He made ONE colossal mistake where he hid something from me about two months after DD that I found (similar to what just happened to your wife.)  He nearly lost me then and that was when he FINALLY got it that he had to be 100% transparent about EVERYTHING.  Whether he thought it would hurt me, whether he thought it was inconsequential, no matter WHAT! From then on he told me anything I asked - and volunteered information he thought might matter to me that I hadn't thought to ask about... and frankly, it is the reason i could start to regain any faith in him.  Had I ever caught him in another lie - whether about another woman or how much he spent at Best Buy, we'd have been done.  I did not have any space in my life to be lied to again, about anything, for any reason.  NONE.  And I deeply loved my husband, but had he continued to be anything less than open and transparent, I would have left him to save myself.  I did not have the emotional strength to continue to be traumatized.  

How your wife is acting is 100% normal.  Since there is a very high rate of post-infidelity suicide attempts (and successes) count yourself lucky that she has found her anger, rather than sink into despair.  That actually shows that her mind and spirit have strength and resiliency.  She knows that she did not deserve this (and she's right).  Her anger is justified and will need to burn itself out over time.  

I suggest three things IMMEDIATELY if you want to save this marriage - actually make that four.  

1) Immediately give up any idea/hope/need that the fallout will end soon.  I can almost GUARANTEE you that the next 18-24 months of your life will be focused on the aftermath of the affair.  And whatever you are experiencing, it will be far, far worse for her.  It will be the first thing she thinks about in the morning and the last thing she thinks about at night.  She will literally not be able to stop thinking about it for a while.  She will wonder what is wrong with her that her husband, the man she trusted and put on a pedestal could do this to her, to value her so little.  She will hate every wrinkle, roll or dimple on her body.  She will tear herself apart wondering what made her so easily betrayed.  She will wonder what the other woman looked like - if you preferred the way she felt, how large her breasts were, if you liked the way she tasted better.  She will have the worst mind movies you can imagine.  Her self-esteem is shattered.  Her trust in her judgement is shattered.  She is humiliated in a way I can't even begin to explain.  The more you hope for it to end, the more you will avoid talking about it when she needs to - and she will need to - SO MUCH MORE THAN YOU WILL WANT TO.  The more you avoid the uncomfortable conversations, the more the pressure will build inside her, the more alone and abandoned she will feel and the MORE angry and depressed she will get.  It will become a vicious cycle.  But if you can man up and are REALLY there for her during the hell that she will go through for the next couple years, you can emerge the other side - happy, in love and filled with gratitude at saving something precious that can never be replaced.  

2) I know you are in therapy and that is great BUT I highly suggest that you book some phone sessions with the man that runs this site, Tim.  He was an unfaithful husband and has more experience with infidelity than most counselors.  You need a LOT of help in understanding what is happening in HER because you clearly have NO CLUE the level of devastation you have caused.  It's as if you think you tripped her and she broke an ankle, where in fact you ran over her with a car and she's in traction fighting for her life.  

3) I also suggest reading a lot of the threads here to understand what your wife is experiencing.  You will hear through our posts, the feelings she will have a hard time articulating to you.  Spend HOURS reading these threads and slowly you will start to get a feel for what is happening in her head.  Let that soften you, and build a well of compassion for her.  Because every time she is showing you anger... what is under it is pain to a degree you cannot know unless you've experienced it and a well of fear that threatens to overwhelm you every moment of every day.  Trying to feel open to loving the very person who just ripped your heart out of your chest feels terrifying for a VERY, VERY long time.  It keeps your nervous system on edge all the time.  Much of what is happening in her right now is completely physiological and largely out of her control.  Her fight or flight mechanism is on constant repeat.  YOU need to make sure she is protected from ANY more surprises.  

4) Buy and read the short book "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda MacDonald.  It is concise and direct, but gives some excellent information about how to approach healing your marriage.  Follow it religiously.  

There is so much more because this is a long and bumpy road you've put yourself on and YOU will need to shoulder the majority of the burden for getting it back on track because your wife is in no condition to, she just found out the last two year's of her life were a lie.  Most of us (BS) experienced rapid weight loss because we were unable to eat, uncontrollable mood swings, inability to sleep, etc... some developed heart problems due to the unrelenting stress in the aftermath.  

Please read that book, please schedule an appointment with Tim Tedder, please read the threads here to shed light on what your wife is experiencing.  Consider reading books that are written for BS (Like "Living and Loving After Betrayal") and sharing with HER what you've been learning about the physical and mental hardships she's facing.  Show her that her pain is important to you - not because it is something to "fix" so you can get back to a happy life, but because it is a burden YOU foisted on her that she didn't deserve.  Prove through actions, words and perseverance that you are going to do whatever you have to in order to help her find her safety, her equilibrium, her peace and regain trust in you (and they all will take a LONG, LONG time.)

If you truly love her this is your restitution.  This is showing true repentance and humility.  When she is having those times when she spirals, do not defend your actions, but when you can say "I know I've let you down.  I know you question if I really love you.  But I DO - more than you will ever know.  But I allowed my own weakness and brokenness to get in the way of that and I am working hard in therapy to find those places in me and heal them so I can be the man you believed me to be.  I won't rest until I am.  I am so sorry I hurt you and I will dedicate myself to proving to you, day in and day out that I am a changed man.  I know you don't believe that yet - and I don't blame you.  I've given you every reason to doubt me.  So all I can do it SHOW you. And that I will do day in and day out for the rest of our lives if I am lucky enough for you to give me that chance." 

And more importantly - LIVE UP TO IT.

Remind her that you KNOW your are lucky to be given that chance.  Because trust me, it took every ounce of courage I could find in myself to try and open myself to my husband again when EVERYTHING in me was screaming to run from this person who had wounded me to my core.  You are asking for more bravery from your wife right now than you can imagine.  Be grateful every time you wake up and she's still there because you have no idea the internal battles she's waging to do so.  

I will leave you with one more thing.  If you can be strong and not make any more devastating mistakes like the one you just did, you have a good chance of repairing this marriage.  And not just an "okay" marriage - but a really beautiful, satisfying one.  My husband and I have grown even closer in the aftermath.  We learned a lot about ourselves and each other and treat our marriage like something precious.  It always was... but we lost sight of it somewhere along the way.  Never again.  But it will take so much work and it is not for the feint of heart.  You will need to commit and be ready to face many dark nights before you see that rainbow of a fully restored marriage.  
BS - Female
Married 27 years, one adult child
DD May 2016

“When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.” - V Frankl
Quote 4 0
Experiencethedevine29

despairwh wrote:
My wife and I have been married for 24 years, been together for more than 30 years. I've been seeing a prostitute off and on for about 2 years until about Nov 2019. 
DDay1 was about 2.5 months ago, I think the first few days were like any other cases, my wife was devastated, angry, sad, full of emotions, wanted to divorce, everything is understandable.  I kept on apologizing and expressing my great remorse for my horrible betrayal, and begged her to give me a chance to save our marriage. 
She didn't exactly agreed to it, but she said she would be extremely embarrassed if everyone (friends, relatives, etc.) knows.  For many years she's been praising to everyone about her "great" husband, an educated, well-respected executive who loves his wife and kids, taking good care of family, adored by the in-laws, who turned out to be a lying devil with a dark, dirty secret that just tore her heart apart.  She hasn't gone ahead with D because she couldn't stand of being viewed as a failure because her husband cheated on her.
I know I deserved to be punished so I patiently took everything she threw at me, and eventually things got better after a few weeks, she finally agreed to give us a chance.
But then DDay2 happened!  She went through my stuff and found a black ring in a small pouch that I use occasionally.  I bought this cheap $20 ring a long time ago when I first started cheating, I was kind of dumb when I first started going to see the prostitute, I took off my ring but then I was embarrassed of the ring mark so I bought this ring to cover it every time I went.  I hid it in various places and completely forgot that I hid it in that bag the last time I used it, I though I dropped it somewhere.  Then I figured prostitutes wouldn't care if their clients were married or not so I didn't bother look for it any more.
I told my wife the truth about the ring and it devastated her, even more than the affair itself.  She was so mad about it because to her, my action meant I wanted to replace our marriage.  I explained that I only did that so I wouldn't feel too guilty (seeing the wedding ring) when I was cheating, it didn't have any other meaning to me.  It was so insignificant to me so I didn't tell her about it, but she insisted that I was still hiding a secret.
It's been a nightmare since DDay2, I've been trying my hardest to keep calm, the constant hours of attack, verbally and some time physically as well, I know I deserve it so take it all.  
But what was really frustrating to me is the accusation, she later accused me of getting that black ring as a new wedding band for my "new relationship".  I explained over and over again, and again that there was no relationship, I've been seeing the prostitute for a sexual fantasy that I don't get at home, yes it was stupid and disgusting but I had no relationship. She refused to accept my explanation, things are just getting worse every day.
I've been trying my hardest to keep my patience and let her expressed her anger, but it's not working. When I tried to explain the black ring, she just screamed in my face that I'm a lying cheater and she doesn't believe it, when I tried to keep quiet and let her vent then she said she know I keep quiet because she was right about my relationship.  I'm being interrogated hours every day, and for every question, there was never the right answer, it's always damned if I do and damn if I don't. 
I still love her and I want to mend our marriage but I feel like she's trying to aggravate me to the point that I give up the M and get a D.  
Am I trying to save an unsalvageable marriage?  I'm getting more and more depressed every day but I'm still refusing to give up.  I'm just very worried that I might not be able to keep it up because I'm starting to feel exhausted.
By the way, I've been in counseling for about 5 weeks now, but my wife refused any kind of help. I feel she's stuck but I don't know how to help her moving forward, I feel so helpless.


Firstly, welcome to the club nobody wants to be in.  We all know it can be daunting indeed for a wayward to post at all.  If you’re brave enough to stick around you will find sage advice from all quarters, although there will be much you might find difficult to hear.  None the less, this is a place of HONESTY so don’t expect any pussy-footing,.  You will hear the truth and it won’t always be pretty, so buckle up and take the ride to possibly a better you.

Theres an awful lot of I’s and me’s in your post.  Your references to your wife are what I would expect from someone who isn’t ‘getting it’ yet.  As Vanessa rightly says, this is  NOT an ‘if I wait long enough, she’ll just get over it eventually’ situation. This is years of blatant lying to her face, even after discovery (which unfortunately is all too common) so your whining about how depressed YOU are and how hard YOU’RE  trying don’t mean s*it mate.

The fact that you didn’t have the balls to tell her about this ‘thing’ you’ve fantasised about (and believe me, whatever it is, I’m all but unshockable.  Himself and I shared many years experimenting until we got old(er), and as a retired nurse I’ve seen it all..) if you hadn’t approached her about it, how did you come to the assumption she would t want to play? Because she’s your wife and she’s supposed to be a ‘good girl’ is a standard excuse for taking yourself off and shagging someone who’ll do it for you, but paying for it?? Were you REALLY that desperate?  NO .....

You say you kept on apologising and ‘expressing your great remorse’...bulls**it. You kept expressing your regret and guilt.  That is NOT the same thing at all.  Guilt is a reference to the behaviour that affects the ‘self’. Remorse is a reference to the behaviour that has affected someone else.  Note the difference.

Your poor wife has been telling everyone what a wonderful husband she has while he’s been shagging some filthy whore behind her back subjecting her to the very real possibility that he could have put her very life at risk.  Yep.  Doesn’t look so good when it’s written down in black and white does it? Every day you made a conscious choice to LIE even by omission, and you cannot expect your wife to be sympathetic to you at this time. YOU  made those choices, deliberately and with intent. Don’t bleat about her being unwilling to ‘see things your way’ because  you have a very long road ahead if you’re intent on trying to salvage what’s left of your relationship  if you have the guts and the wherewithal to REALLY  work toward a new life with your wife.  Your marriage is over chummy, so your wondering if it’s a marriage you can save isn’t applicable.  The question should be, have I got the balls to work toward a new marriage and be the husband my wife deserves.

Every time your wife discovers something new you haven’t told her, it sends her right back to that very fresh pain of discovery. So my advice to you is to tell her EVERYTHING  honestly, NOW. If you can’t do this, then your marriage may be unsalvable because she will NEVER be able to believe a word you say  Whatever discomfort you’re  feeling at the moment, is a1000 times less than the pain you’ve inflicted on the person you swore to protect and respect. Her repetitive questioning is TRAUMATICALLY RELATED, like PTSD as she seeks reassurance and answers. Her whole marriage to you is in question.   No wonder she’s all over the place and behaving erratically, as FanofMike points out.  Your whinging about how hard it is to take her very real anguish Is just that I’m afraid... whinging and whining.  Time to grow some balls and do whatever it’s going to take. Your wife does NOT feel safe with you.  It’s up to YOU to put the work in, she’s in no place to hold your hand right now.

You should BOTH be in therapy separately.  She needs it as much as you, though for her she needs a space where she feels safe to express her pain and anguish, and you to discover how you could allow yourself to behave in such an appalling way. As FanofMike says.  Was the prostitute REALLY worth risking everything for?

i wish you luck.  Keep posting your thoughts, and others will be along with their sage experience.

ETD 🌻

The grass always looks greener..until the dog pee’s on it....
Quote 3 0
despairwh
I understand why everyone sympathizes with the betrayed spouse and quickly condemns the cheater.

But it seems that you all missed the main reason why I posted:  my wife refuses to get help.

She doesn't want to talk to anyone (friends, relatives, anyone) and refuses to seek professional help (conseling, therapy, etc.) and things are just getting worse and worse every day.

I've been in counselling for awhile, learning how to cope with the situation, I've done countless reading and watching videos. I've followed all the advises and suggestions I learned about providing support for my wife but things are just getting worse, not better, especially with the physical attacks.  I used to get a few slaps every time she came to "talk",  then escalated to slaps and punches, and recently added scratching and choking with along with punches.  Today looking in the mirror I'm black and blue all over my upper body and arms, with scratches in various places.   I'm trying the best I can to help her find a way to release her frustration and anger, just remained calm and take all the abuses, but I'm getting exhausted and I don't know how much more I can endure.
Quote 0 0
Experiencethedevine29
despairwh wrote:
I understand why everyone sympathizes with the betrayed spouse and quickly condemns the cheater.

But it seems that you all missed the main reason why I posted:  my wife refuses to get help.

She doesn't want to talk to anyone (friends, relatives, anyone) and refuses to seek professional help (conseling, therapy, etc.) and things are just getting worse and worse every day.

I've been in counselling for awhile, learning how to cope with the situation, I've done countless reading and watching videos. I've followed all the advises and suggestions I learned about providing support for my wife but things are just getting worse, not better, especially with the physical attacks.  I used to get a few slaps every time she came to "talk",  then escalated to slaps and punches, and recently added scratching and choking with along with punches.  Today looking in the mirror I'm black and blue all over my upper body and arms, with scratches in various places.   I'm trying the best I can to help her find a way to release her frustration and anger, just remained calm and take all the abuses, but I'm getting exhausted and I don't know how much more I can endure.


NOBODY should suffer physical abuse, so if you’re saying your wife is physically attacking you there is only one choice surely. She gets help or you leave until she does.

ETD 🌻
The grass always looks greener..until the dog pee’s on it....
Quote 0 0
BlindCheetah


NOBODY should suffer physical abuse, so if you’re saying your wife is physically attacking you there is only one choice surely. She gets help or you leave until she does.

ETD 🌻


I agree, the anger is justified the violence is not. 

Female BS
Married 19 years 
2 tween girls

DDay 10/2019 
Affair 1, 11/2010 to 2/2011
Affair 2, 6/2019 to 12/2019 - Persistent One is still trying to contact him. 

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Vanessa
despairwh wrote:


But it seems that you all missed the main reason why I posted:  my wife refuses to get help.

She doesn't want to talk to anyone (friends, relatives, anyone) and refuses to seek professional help (conseling, therapy, etc.) and things are just getting worse and worse every day.


This SOUNDS like you are frustrated that your wife is not healing on your time schedule - she heals (if ever) on her time schedule not yours.

That being said, enduring prolonged physical attacks from her is not healthy for either of you.  Maybe you both need some physical distance to process things. 
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Crushed
No physical abuse is not good.  But asking from previous  experience are you sure you are not doing something to provoke the violence.  While trying to talk to WS he would get mad and frustrated when questioned and he then would get in my personal space, get inches from my face and scream at me, splattering spit in my face the whole time. He would have fists balled an was truly trying to intimate me into submission.  I  always felt that I was backed into a corner and it was fight for your survival.  And yes I did, I would no longer be be treated that way. And it was exactly what he wanted then he had reason to push shove,  grab hold of me to subdue me and scream directly into my ear.  He felt power over me by doing these things.   Check your words, check your behavior, and your own body language.  If you find that you are contributing to it stop.  If not then its time to separate before it escalates out of control.
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ThrivenotSurvive
The level of physical abuse was not clear form your initial post.  As you can see, everyone is in clear agreement that it is unacceptable.  I concur.

Since you seem to wish to save the marriage, I would suggest writing her a letter.  This will allow you to give it to her at a time when she is relatively calm, ask her to read it when she is ready and then express your desire for the two of you to discuss it when she is ready.

In the letter I would pour your heart out.  Tell her how sorry you are, how you wish you could go back in time and undo the poor choices you made, how much you love her and hope to restore your marriage.  Tell her that you are willing to answer your questions, as many times as it takes, even thought it is deeply shaming and painful because you understand that it is part of her healing.  BUT explain that physical abuse is not somethign you are willing to accept.  Under any circumstances.  Not you to her, or her to you.  And that if it continues, you will have to leave for both of your sakes. 

Then share with her that it breaks your heart to see her in the pain she is and you know that it is your fault.  Tell her that you would really like to pay for her to see her OWN counselor and maybe someday if she wants to - a marriage counselor together.  Not because there is anything wrong with her or because she needs to be fixed, but because you have unfairly traumatized her and you want to help her recover from that since it is not her fault and a burden that she shouldn't have to carry alone.  This is IMPORTANT, because it often feels like your WS is telling you that you are crazy or "the problem" when they ask you to see a counselor.

In our mind it is a bit galling.  The only reason you have become this person or are acting this way is in response to their cruelty.  So while it is in your own best interest to seek help, it feels like they get to take the easy way out - again.  They didn't get what they wanted in the marriage, and they cheated (the easy way to getting what they wanted.)  Now you are hurt, angry, despairing and they want you to go "see someone" so you can get "fixed" and they can get a nice, comfortable life back.  I know that isn't what you are thinking - but it is how it FEELS to the traumatized mind.  You need to do everything in your power to help her see it differently.  

I suggest comparing it to being run over with a car.  She wouldn't try to heal her broken bones and fractured body parts without seeing a doctor.  Well, unfortunately, in many ways this is worse.  There are substantial mental, emotional AND physical stresses happening simultaneously.  Her  body is under near constant assault from fight or flight hormones that our bodies are NOT meant to have flooding our systems for months on end.  She needs to see someone because she has experienced a trauma that leaves PTSD equivalent symptoms in many survivors.  She wouldn't look down on someone who'd been in war, or a traumatic event (an intruder in their home) needing help... well, there was in intruder in her life.  Actually two.  Because you've become a stranger to her overnight as well and her life, which she thought she knew, has become a hall of fun house mirrors.  Nothing looks the same and she now questions every feeling expressed between the two of you, every memory, every moment.   That IS HUGELY traumatic.  So there is no shame in needing help for it.  

She will resent that SHE has to deal with the aftermath of YOUR decisions.  I found it very difficult to swallow that bitter pill as well.  But if she wants to be happy and whole again, with or without you, she will need to.  Nobody deserves cancer, but it still happens and you have to get treatment if you want to live.  She didn't deserve this either, but if she wants to live with any level of happiness, security or calm, she will need to seek treatment.  Unfair? Yes.  But still true.

If she is at all willing, tell her about this forum.  We can be a resource and outlet for her pain here.  And she never has to share her name or any personal information.  Many of us found that our shame kept us from reaching out to friends, family, counselors, etc.  This was the starting spot (and at times the only place) where we could come to feel less alone.  Less "defective".  It takes an unbelievable amount of time to stop seeing your partner cheating as something about them rather than a reflection on you.  She spent years feeling a little "special".  Now she feels that she not only isn't "special", she's not enough.  If she were, her husband wouldn't have been willing to lose her.  Again, I know that isn't true - but it IS how it feels for a very long time.  
BS - Female
Married 27 years, one adult child
DD May 2016

“When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.” - V Frankl
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despairwh
Crushed wrote:
...But asking from previous  experience are you sure you are not doing something to provoke the violence...

Absolutely not.  I've done a lot of research and also in counseling myself, I know the only thing that I can say right now is "I'm sorry I caused you pain" or something similar.
In the 30+ years we've been together, I've never laid a hand on her, on the contrary, if we ever had any heated discussions in the past, she was the one who get physical and I was always the one who tried to get away to avoid getting hurt.
I'm not the only one who's afraid of her when she gets mad, the kids are terrified whenever she gets angry with them and I had to interfere to calm her down many times in the past.
Everyone who knows us would definitely say that she's the "boss" in our home.
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Vanessa
Not sure if this helps at all but. . .
"I'm sorry I caused you pain" used to piss me off no end.  It struck me as "its not what i did that is the problem, its your reaction to it"  I am NOT saying this is in ANY way your intent - just how i heard it as a BS.

What i wanted to hear was "I am sorry that I thought only of myself, and that my deliberate actions did in fact cause the pain that I could have foreseen if I had thought about it for even a minute.  I am sorry for not speaking to you and instead going behind your back, thereby eroding your trust in me and our entire life history together.  I am sorry for doing the actions that brought us to this place." 

It may not be the same for others including your wife.
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despairwh
... I would suggest writing her a letter.  This will allow you to give it to her at a time when she is relatively calm, ask her to read it when she is ready and then express your desire for the two of you to discuss it when she is ready.
In the letter I would pour your heart out.  Tell her how sorry you are, how you wish you could go back in time and undo the poor choices you made, how much you love her and hope to restore your marriage... 

Thanks for the suggestion, I've written a letter once, she tore it without reading.  I've sent text messages late at night from time to time to tell her how horrible I feel for betraying her trust for me, she usually responded with "Too Late!" or "F U lying bastard"
She had told me several times that she doesn't let me stay in the house because she wants to reconcile, she just doesn't want other people to know, and she also wants me to stay so that she can scream at me everyday.
 
...  Tell her that you would really like to pay for her to see her OWN counselor and maybe someday if she wants to - a marriage counselor together. ... 

Money is not an issue in our house, she's a homemaker and she has access to all our finances.  I've begged her to see someone, anyone, so that she can get it off her chest, and she can just walk out any time, but she refuses and told me not to suggest that again.  Her reasoning is "I'm not the one who F up our home", or "No one can help me, and I don't want to feel better so STOP ASKING"

As I said, I've done a lot of research, I KNOW it may take YEARS for a betrayed spouse to slowly get better, and I'm willing to take the abuses, I've sat there day after day, night after night and listen to her, and kept saying "I'm sorry", but I feel helpless because she seems stuck in limbo and getting angrier everyday, and I can't help her. 

It's painful to see her like that, one night last week when she was screaming into my face, I looked at her and realized that I've probably made her aged several years in the last 3 months, I felt so bad that I broke down and cried which I have never done in the past.  I kept apologizing because I know she's been suffering, but not sure why got angry and said that I was just acting...
I can take it all, even some physical abuses, but if it keeps escalating like this, I don't think my body can take it much longer.
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ThrivenotSurvive

Vanessa - I agree.  Just saying I am sorry bothered me too.  But when my husband got good at listening to what I was saying and responding to it, it really helped.  


So if I was saying, “I don’t feel like I can trust myself.  I knew something was wrong but I never believed you could do this...“. It helped when he said “I am so sorry that I made you doubt yourself.  I am sorry that I took your trust and used it against you.”  That said to me that he understood what was going on in my head.  

That helped a LOT more.  

BS - Female
Married 27 years, one adult child
DD May 2016

“When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.” - V Frankl
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